Replying to Uta Frith's views, one by one.
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@joshsusser @SecondUniverse @KatyElphinstone *neuro average?
@Fizzfizzpopop @SecondUniverse @KatyElphinstone I'd like a term that describes the neurotype based on its character, not that it is common. There are a lot of ways to say it's typical but they all say "neurosupremacy" to me.
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Replying to Uta Frith's views, one by one.
With thanks to all the members of the autistic community who've informed me & inspired me to write this thread.
For those lucky not to know about her article in The Times, and various other related statements, links at the end.
CW: it's upsetting
A thread 🧵
#UtaFrith #Research #Autism #Autistic #ActuallyAutistic #Neurodivergent
@KatyElphinstone Never heard of this lady, just read a few things and came to the conclusion that we are looking at an old woman with borderline theories who is afraid of her own insignificance. Apart from the self-preserving duty to contradict bullshit, I think we can just ignore the old lady, like the other bullshit that neurotypical freaks pull out of their asses.
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Yes, all the assumptions... Awful to think on. No wonder trauma is so common.
@KatyElphinstone @lizzard I still can't believe they did that to me. I'm glad I can't remember it, but still, so barbaric!
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Yes that's a very good point! In fact there's evidence other populations suffer similarly, as you say.
But masking isn't a diagnostic category for autism, anyway. It's more about just recognising that it's a common thing that happens.
@KatyElphinstone @quidcumque @lizzard I'm not convinced that masking is wholely different from what NTs do to fit it. Some aspects are unique but a lot of it is just the amount and difficulty level.
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The particular family member I am thinking about (mum) was always going to be difficult to tell, when I told her about my ADHD diagnosis a few years ago her response was "don't be ridiculous, everyone is like that". At which point I decided this was probably not the point to mention that these things often run in families and noped out of the conversation.
She already thinks you can't be autistic without speech and language difficulties, so very little I say is going to make any difference
@PetraPhoenix @KatyElphinstone TBF she's only 30 years out of date on the speech and language issues.
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@PetraPhoenix @KatyElphinstone TBF she's only 30 years out of date on the speech and language issues.
@BernieDoesIt @KatyElphinstone
Yeah but at least 2 of her grandchildren are Autistic, and none of them are that old so
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Her view: Autism in women has gone too far.
Reply: Interesting. Has freedom in women gone too far, too?
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Her view: We must categorise autism into smaller subgroups.
Reply: Interesting also - a bit like how Hans Asperger did in Nazi Germany? I think, in this case, the purpose is to exclude a lot of people from the category "autism" and to divide the autistic community.
️@KatyElphinstone She's right that autism isn't just one thing, but I think C.L. Lynch said it best: it's a "collection of related neurological conditions that are so intertwined and so impossible to pick apart that professionals have stopped trying."
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@KatyElphinstone She's right that autism isn't just one thing, but I think C.L. Lynch said it best: it's a "collection of related neurological conditions that are so intertwined and so impossible to pick apart that professionals have stopped trying."
Nicely put
Autistic people are more heterogeneous within the group than non-autistics. I've been finding this really interesting!
We are more different from each other than neurotypical people are from one another. Even epigenetically, apparently. Which I think is quite cool
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@KatyElphinstone She's right that autism isn't just one thing, but I think C.L. Lynch said it best: it's a "collection of related neurological conditions that are so intertwined and so impossible to pick apart that professionals have stopped trying."
@KatyElphinstone Somehow to me the phrasing "collection of related neurological conditions that are so intertwined and so impossible to pick apart that professionals have stopped trying" could also be used to describe a personality, any personality really (including but not limited to those of dogs, cats, and birds).
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@KatyElphinstone @quidcumque @lizzard I'm not convinced that masking is wholely different from what NTs do to fit it. Some aspects are unique but a lot of it is just the amount and difficulty level.
@BernieDoesIt agree completely. The amount *is* what causes problems.
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@Fizzfizzpopop @SecondUniverse @KatyElphinstone I'd like a term that describes the neurotype based on its character, not that it is common. There are a lot of ways to say it's typical but they all say "neurosupremacy" to me.
@joshsusser @SecondUniverse @KatyElphinstone I don't know, I think average is not a term for anyone outstanding. Perhaps we should designate neuro average and neuro outstanding? Hehehe
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@joshsusser @SecondUniverse @KatyElphinstone I don't know, I think average is not a term for anyone outstanding. Perhaps we should designate neuro average and neuro outstanding? Hehehe
@joshsusser @SecondUniverse @KatyElphinstone I'll bagsi a self description as neuro outstanding, sometimes in a *good* way hahahaha
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@KatyElphinstone @quidcumque @lizzard I'm not convinced that masking is wholely different from what NTs do to fit it. Some aspects are unique but a lot of it is just the amount and difficulty level.
Yes, it's about the extent of it, and the impact on your life. How much of yourself do you have to hide just to get by? And how much effort does it take to do so?
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Yes, it's about the extent of it, and the impact on your life. How much of yourself do you have to hide just to get by? And how much effort does it take to do so?
@KatyElphinstone @quidcumque @lizzard That's more for some NTs than others but significantly more for NDs.
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Yes
It troubles me that so often they wheel out women to support the dominant paradigm, and essentially very patriarchal views & interests.
I think it's not a coincidence. It's just too convenient. I think they're being played. I never really want to attack the individual, just the views.
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@KatyElphinstone @Tooden @joshsusser @simondassow @adelinej neurofeely vs neurothinky?
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@KatyElphinstone @SecondUniverse @adelinej Uta #Frith was a coauthor, with Simon #BaronCohen, on the original 1985 paper introducing the hopelessly muddled "theory of mind" concept, the phlogiston of autism science. She certainly doesn't have any legitimate claim still to be taken seriously in 2026.
@KatyElphinstone @SecondUniverse @adelinej Oh, and: due to technical difficulties on this device, I couldn't actually see the Uta #Frith interview before. I just glanced through it on my desktop PC. It's even worse than I expected. I particularly noticed the following gem:
"This population is different. It is made up of a lot of adolescents, and among them, a lot of young women. These are people without intellectual impairment, who are perfectly able to communicate verbally and non-verbally, but who might feel highly anxious in social situations. They are perhaps characterised mainly by a sort of hypersensitivity."
This declaration shows such flagrant disregard not only of current scientific research on autism, but even of its early history all the way back to Hans #Asperger, that it’s hard to believe it was uttered in good faith. The misogynistic stereotyping is also remarkable, especially coming from a female scholar.
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@KatyElphinstone @SecondUniverse @adelinej Oh, and: due to technical difficulties on this device, I couldn't actually see the Uta #Frith interview before. I just glanced through it on my desktop PC. It's even worse than I expected. I particularly noticed the following gem:
"This population is different. It is made up of a lot of adolescents, and among them, a lot of young women. These are people without intellectual impairment, who are perfectly able to communicate verbally and non-verbally, but who might feel highly anxious in social situations. They are perhaps characterised mainly by a sort of hypersensitivity."
This declaration shows such flagrant disregard not only of current scientific research on autism, but even of its early history all the way back to Hans #Asperger, that it’s hard to believe it was uttered in good faith. The misogynistic stereotyping is also remarkable, especially coming from a female scholar.
@dedicto @KatyElphinstone @SecondUniverse @adelinej
To be honest I couldn't even bring myself to open the original post. I just knew that it would be as bad as everyone has said.
There is a general trend amongst the old guard of researchers, even those who may have once done some good for our understanding. It's a kind of nose severally out of joint, only professionals know best arrogance and rejection of the progress that is being made. Mostly because so much of it is autistic and community led.
It is the closed mindset so typical of medical and research based communities especially. That won't listen to the true experts, those who daily experience something, and instead cling to the belief that taught knowledge, even if it is decades painfully out of date and which, of course they are the appointed and solely qualified guardians of, can only ever be the truth and any thing else can't.
