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CIRCLE WITH A DOT

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  3. Semi serious question, (please do not ask "AI") I can do web searches just fine so please answer from your own experience:

Semi serious question, (please do not ask "AI") I can do web searches just fine so please answer from your own experience:

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askfedi
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  • hakona@im.alstadheim.noH hakona@im.alstadheim.no

    @afreytes Norwegian: No arbitrary description like "Four Letter Word". There are descriptive words for the group, that would be like "cuss-words" "power-expressions" "unpolished language".

    franceskamann@freeradical.zoneF This user is from outside of this forum
    franceskamann@freeradical.zoneF This user is from outside of this forum
    franceskamann@freeradical.zone
    wrote last edited by
    #34

    @hakona @afreytes

    Power expressions. I like that!

    1 Reply Last reply
    0
    • afreytes@mastodon.gamedev.placeA afreytes@mastodon.gamedev.place

      Semi serious question, (please do not ask "AI") I can do web searches just fine so please answer from your own experience:

      In English, you have "four letter words", these words have four letters but are perhaps not to be used in polite communication.

      In OTHER languages: Are there any other "group of words constrained by arbitrary rules"?

      Does NOT have to be an offensive group of words, but more like a grouping outside the traditional language syntax.

      #AskFedi

      (no answer? please boost)

      franceskamann@freeradical.zoneF This user is from outside of this forum
      franceskamann@freeradical.zoneF This user is from outside of this forum
      franceskamann@freeradical.zone
      wrote last edited by
      #35

      @afreytes

      Someone once pointed out my use of " the isms" as in racism, sexism, theism, etc.

      1 Reply Last reply
      0
      • gbargoud@masto.nycG gbargoud@masto.nyc

        @afreytes

        Don't know of any similar arbitrary grouping in French or Arabic.

        Similarly I wonder what other languages do about "teenagers", do they just say "adolescents" or do they also have an arbitrary group of ages based on prefixes or suffixes?

        gbargoud@masto.nycG This user is from outside of this forum
        gbargoud@masto.nycG This user is from outside of this forum
        gbargoud@masto.nyc
        wrote last edited by
        #36

        @afreytes

        Tugging on the teenager thread, I found out that the Polish equivalent is 11-19 and the Hungarian one is 10-19 because of the way the words for those numbers are formed.

        1 Reply Last reply
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        • lukyan@lukyan.euL lukyan@lukyan.eu

          @afreytes I'm not aware of any in Polish: I think more of groups of objects than words. But we have "cztery litery" ("four letters") as one of the euphemisms for buttocks, referencing two such four letter words.

          slothrop@chaos.socialS This user is from outside of this forum
          slothrop@chaos.socialS This user is from outside of this forum
          slothrop@chaos.social
          wrote last edited by
          #37

          @lukyan @afreytes hah, the same thing exists in German („vier Buchstaben“)

          1 Reply Last reply
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          • rhelune@todon.euR This user is from outside of this forum
            rhelune@todon.euR This user is from outside of this forum
            rhelune@todon.eu
            wrote last edited by
            #38

            @CorvidCrone @afreytes Some call it legalese.

            I've also heard of "psychobabble" and lately of therapy speak, especially in the context of weaponising it.

            Also technobabble.

            But all of them in English.

            1 Reply Last reply
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            • afreytes@mastodon.gamedev.placeA afreytes@mastodon.gamedev.place

              Semi serious question, (please do not ask "AI") I can do web searches just fine so please answer from your own experience:

              In English, you have "four letter words", these words have four letters but are perhaps not to be used in polite communication.

              In OTHER languages: Are there any other "group of words constrained by arbitrary rules"?

              Does NOT have to be an offensive group of words, but more like a grouping outside the traditional language syntax.

              #AskFedi

              (no answer? please boost)

              drsaucy@sfba.socialD This user is from outside of this forum
              drsaucy@sfba.socialD This user is from outside of this forum
              drsaucy@sfba.social
              wrote last edited by
              #39

              @afreytes I'm not sure this fits the bill, but your query made me think of reduplicatives in Tagolog, which indicate emphasis, intensity, speed, etc. For example, mabilis-mabilis (fast becomes very fast), araw-araw (day becomes every day), ganda-ganda (beauty to most beautiful).

              afreytes@mastodon.gamedev.placeA 1 Reply Last reply
              0
              • drsaucy@sfba.socialD drsaucy@sfba.social

                @afreytes I'm not sure this fits the bill, but your query made me think of reduplicatives in Tagolog, which indicate emphasis, intensity, speed, etc. For example, mabilis-mabilis (fast becomes very fast), araw-araw (day becomes every day), ganda-ganda (beauty to most beautiful).

                afreytes@mastodon.gamedev.placeA This user is from outside of this forum
                afreytes@mastodon.gamedev.placeA This user is from outside of this forum
                afreytes@mastodon.gamedev.place
                wrote last edited by
                #40

                @DrSaucy oh I think Hawaiian also has this? The wiki in wikipedia I think means fast but wiki-wiki means faster IIRC...

                Yes I like3 this... I didnt know reduplicatives is the word for it. Thanks!

                drsaucy@sfba.socialD 1 Reply Last reply
                0
                • afreytes@mastodon.gamedev.placeA afreytes@mastodon.gamedev.place

                  @DrSaucy oh I think Hawaiian also has this? The wiki in wikipedia I think means fast but wiki-wiki means faster IIRC...

                  Yes I like3 this... I didnt know reduplicatives is the word for it. Thanks!

                  drsaucy@sfba.socialD This user is from outside of this forum
                  drsaucy@sfba.socialD This user is from outside of this forum
                  drsaucy@sfba.social
                  wrote last edited by
                  #41

                  @afreytes I immediately thought of wikiwiki after I posted, but awaited your reply in case my example wasn't relevant to your request.

                  Other Hawaiian reduplicatives of which I'm aware, but quite likely lost in Hawaiian to Haole: holoholo (from stroll/amble to run around), mahimahi (strong to brute strength) makemake (like to desire).

                  1 Reply Last reply
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                  • fgbjr@indieweb.socialF This user is from outside of this forum
                    fgbjr@indieweb.socialF This user is from outside of this forum
                    fgbjr@indieweb.social
                    wrote last edited by
                    #42

                    @oheso @afreytes At a faculty dinner, back when I was still working full time, the restaurant was tatami style, and at the shoe lockers I put mine in number "42," as I generally do when it's available. A European colleague much more obsessive about appearances and local trivia than I was looked on, scowled, and said, "That's a bad one: SHI [written as 四 for 'four' or as 死 for 'death'] NI [二 for 'two' or the particle に meaning roughly 'to' or 'toward' or 'at']."

                    This is an example of 余計なお世話.

                    1 Reply Last reply
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                    • fgbjr@indieweb.socialF This user is from outside of this forum
                      fgbjr@indieweb.socialF This user is from outside of this forum
                      fgbjr@indieweb.social
                      wrote last edited by
                      #43

                      @oheso @afreytes It's effectively the same answer with the humor removed from it. 😐 (And I hasten to add that the offending European was not from Germany!)

                      1 Reply Last reply
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                      • blogdiva@mastodon.socialB blogdiva@mastodon.social

                        not en español. it’s one of those anglicismos i have yet to find a proper way to translate.

                        @afreytes

                        adriano@lile.clA This user is from outside of this forum
                        adriano@lile.clA This user is from outside of this forum
                        adriano@lile.cl
                        wrote last edited by
                        #44

                        @blogdiva @afreytes On the other hand, “anglicismos” (English loanwords adapted to Spanish) and all the -ismos that describe Spanish variants like Argentinismo, Chilenismo, etc. could be “groups of words outside the standard rules of syntax”.

                        alsopaisleycat@tenforward.socialA 1 Reply Last reply
                        0
                        • afreytes@mastodon.gamedev.placeA afreytes@mastodon.gamedev.place

                          Semi serious question, (please do not ask "AI") I can do web searches just fine so please answer from your own experience:

                          In English, you have "four letter words", these words have four letters but are perhaps not to be used in polite communication.

                          In OTHER languages: Are there any other "group of words constrained by arbitrary rules"?

                          Does NOT have to be an offensive group of words, but more like a grouping outside the traditional language syntax.

                          #AskFedi

                          (no answer? please boost)

                          thierry@twit.socialT This user is from outside of this forum
                          thierry@twit.socialT This user is from outside of this forum
                          thierry@twit.social
                          wrote last edited by
                          #45

                          @afreytes In French Canada (at least in the province of Québec) we have “mots d’église" (ie: church words). Basically swear words, often with adjusted spellings (ex: tabernacle = tabarnak!). They can be combined for effect.

                          Québec used to be a very religious place…

                          You’ll mostly hear such swears around you except for the occasional “marde” in combination with a church word or “merde” if not.

                          afreytes@mastodon.gamedev.placeA alison@beige.partyA 2 Replies Last reply
                          0
                          • thierry@twit.socialT thierry@twit.social

                            @afreytes In French Canada (at least in the province of Québec) we have “mots d’église" (ie: church words). Basically swear words, often with adjusted spellings (ex: tabernacle = tabarnak!). They can be combined for effect.

                            Québec used to be a very religious place…

                            You’ll mostly hear such swears around you except for the occasional “marde” in combination with a church word or “merde” if not.

                            afreytes@mastodon.gamedev.placeA This user is from outside of this forum
                            afreytes@mastodon.gamedev.placeA This user is from outside of this forum
                            afreytes@mastodon.gamedev.place
                            wrote last edited by
                            #46

                            @thierry oh my! This made e remember in Puerto Rico we have "palabras de Domingo" i.e. "Sunday Words" which is almost like saying church words! And "palabras de Domingo" are multi-sillabic very long words which would usually be used by more well read people, often in church.

                            Thank you! I love that!

                            1 Reply Last reply
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                            • adriano@lile.clA adriano@lile.cl

                              @blogdiva @afreytes On the other hand, “anglicismos” (English loanwords adapted to Spanish) and all the -ismos that describe Spanish variants like Argentinismo, Chilenismo, etc. could be “groups of words outside the standard rules of syntax”.

                              alsopaisleycat@tenforward.socialA This user is from outside of this forum
                              alsopaisleycat@tenforward.socialA This user is from outside of this forum
                              alsopaisleycat@tenforward.social
                              wrote last edited by
                              #47

                              @adriano
                              That would apply to anglicisms into any other language as well as calques (loan words or word for word phrases). I don’t think it’s what OP is looking for.

                              Quebecois French authorities are always on the alert for ‘anglicismes’.

                              Even so, there are calques, as well as local idiomatic usage and expressions, that exist in both English and French where there is a high level of bilingualism. e.g. people in western Quebec and Eastern Ontario often use the verb ‘to close’ / ‘fermer’ rather than ‘shut down’ / ‘éteindre’ their computer. It’s not considered correct English or French but it’s what’s commonly used.

                              @blogdiva @afreytes

                              afreytes@mastodon.gamedev.placeA 1 Reply Last reply
                              0
                              • afreytes@mastodon.gamedev.placeA afreytes@mastodon.gamedev.place

                                Semi serious question, (please do not ask "AI") I can do web searches just fine so please answer from your own experience:

                                In English, you have "four letter words", these words have four letters but are perhaps not to be used in polite communication.

                                In OTHER languages: Are there any other "group of words constrained by arbitrary rules"?

                                Does NOT have to be an offensive group of words, but more like a grouping outside the traditional language syntax.

                                #AskFedi

                                (no answer? please boost)

                                amberage@eldritch.cafeA This user is from outside of this forum
                                amberage@eldritch.cafeA This user is from outside of this forum
                                amberage@eldritch.cafe
                                wrote last edited by
                                #48

                                @afreytes outside of i.e. professional jargon, I can't think of any example 🤔 possibly certain sociolects, but that's not purely about words, it's also pronounciation, grammar, etc.

                                Perhaps the closest thing is "Jugendwörter" ("youth words"), loosely referring to teenage slang and a ittle more closely referring especially to words nominated for the "Jugendwort des Jahres" ("youth word of the year") award? That's the only named collection of words I can think of that are connected not by genre (noun/verb/etc).

                                (All of this is German, btw)

                                1 Reply Last reply
                                0
                                • afreytes@mastodon.gamedev.placeA afreytes@mastodon.gamedev.place

                                  Semi serious question, (please do not ask "AI") I can do web searches just fine so please answer from your own experience:

                                  In English, you have "four letter words", these words have four letters but are perhaps not to be used in polite communication.

                                  In OTHER languages: Are there any other "group of words constrained by arbitrary rules"?

                                  Does NOT have to be an offensive group of words, but more like a grouping outside the traditional language syntax.

                                  #AskFedi

                                  (no answer? please boost)

                                  thomasfuchs@hachyderm.ioT This user is from outside of this forum
                                  thomasfuchs@hachyderm.ioT This user is from outside of this forum
                                  thomasfuchs@hachyderm.io
                                  wrote last edited by
                                  #49

                                  @afreytes it’s not a rule, it’s a euphemism, which English is full of (presumably because lots of radical Christians)

                                  it’s just a coincidence that there’s quite a few swear words with four letters

                                  afreytes@mastodon.gamedev.placeA 1 Reply Last reply
                                  0
                                  • alsopaisleycat@tenforward.socialA alsopaisleycat@tenforward.social

                                    @adriano
                                    That would apply to anglicisms into any other language as well as calques (loan words or word for word phrases). I don’t think it’s what OP is looking for.

                                    Quebecois French authorities are always on the alert for ‘anglicismes’.

                                    Even so, there are calques, as well as local idiomatic usage and expressions, that exist in both English and French where there is a high level of bilingualism. e.g. people in western Quebec and Eastern Ontario often use the verb ‘to close’ / ‘fermer’ rather than ‘shut down’ / ‘éteindre’ their computer. It’s not considered correct English or French but it’s what’s commonly used.

                                    @blogdiva @afreytes

                                    afreytes@mastodon.gamedev.placeA This user is from outside of this forum
                                    afreytes@mastodon.gamedev.placeA This user is from outside of this forum
                                    afreytes@mastodon.gamedev.place
                                    wrote last edited by
                                    #50

                                    @AlsoPaisleyCat @adriano @blogdiva you are right that "loan words" is not what I was looking for.

                                    But can you expand on "Quebecois French authorities are always on the alert for ‘anglicismes’."?

                                    Does this mean entities get fined for using foreign words? I'm picturing a sort referee taking out a red card when someone misuses an English word! 😇🤭

                                    alsopaisleycat@tenforward.socialA adriano@lile.clA 2 Replies Last reply
                                    0
                                    • thomasfuchs@hachyderm.ioT thomasfuchs@hachyderm.io

                                      @afreytes it’s not a rule, it’s a euphemism, which English is full of (presumably because lots of radical Christians)

                                      it’s just a coincidence that there’s quite a few swear words with four letters

                                      afreytes@mastodon.gamedev.placeA This user is from outside of this forum
                                      afreytes@mastodon.gamedev.placeA This user is from outside of this forum
                                      afreytes@mastodon.gamedev.place
                                      wrote last edited by
                                      #51

                                      @thomasfuchs I know this, this is an uneeded explanation. Thanks but this is not an answer in the spirit of my question.

                                      thomasfuchs@hachyderm.ioT 1 Reply Last reply
                                      0
                                      • afreytes@mastodon.gamedev.placeA afreytes@mastodon.gamedev.place

                                        Semi serious question, (please do not ask "AI") I can do web searches just fine so please answer from your own experience:

                                        In English, you have "four letter words", these words have four letters but are perhaps not to be used in polite communication.

                                        In OTHER languages: Are there any other "group of words constrained by arbitrary rules"?

                                        Does NOT have to be an offensive group of words, but more like a grouping outside the traditional language syntax.

                                        #AskFedi

                                        (no answer? please boost)

                                        max@manmachine.meM This user is from outside of this forum
                                        max@manmachine.meM This user is from outside of this forum
                                        max@manmachine.me
                                        wrote last edited by
                                        #52
                                        There is a similar construct in Russian also centred around profanity, but with a three-letter word, so the equivalent of "go to hell" becomes "go to three letters", and it's assumed everyone knows which three.
                                        afreytes@mastodon.gamedev.placeA 1 Reply Last reply
                                        0
                                        • max@manmachine.meM max@manmachine.me
                                          There is a similar construct in Russian also centred around profanity, but with a three-letter word, so the equivalent of "go to hell" becomes "go to three letters", and it's assumed everyone knows which three.
                                          afreytes@mastodon.gamedev.placeA This user is from outside of this forum
                                          afreytes@mastodon.gamedev.placeA This user is from outside of this forum
                                          afreytes@mastodon.gamedev.place
                                          wrote last edited by
                                          #53

                                          @max oooh... Is Hell also three letters in Russian? Please tell

                                          max@manmachine.meM 1 Reply Last reply
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