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  3. The Supreme Court has just turned down a petition to hear an appeal in a case that held that AI works can't be copyrighted.

The Supreme Court has just turned down a petition to hear an appeal in a case that held that AI works can't be copyrighted.

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  • pluralistic@mamot.frP pluralistic@mamot.fr

    "Termination" is a part of copyright law that lets creators take back their rights after 35 years, even if they originally signed a contract for a "perpetual license."

    Under termination, all kinds of creative workers who got royally screwed at the start of their careers were able to get their copyrights back and re-sell them. The primary beneficiaries of termination are musicians, who signed notoriously shitty contracts in the 1950s-1980s:

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    Take it back – Pluralistic: Daily links from Cory Doctorow

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    wrote last edited by
    #24

    When Mitch Glazier snuck a termination-destroying clause into legislation, he set the stage for the poorest, most abused, most admired musicians in recording history to lose access to money that let them buy a couple bags of groceries and make the rent. He condemned these beloved musicians to poverty.

    What happened next is something of a Smurfs Family Christmas miracle.

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    • pluralistic@mamot.frP pluralistic@mamot.fr

      When Mitch Glazier snuck a termination-destroying clause into legislation, he set the stage for the poorest, most abused, most admired musicians in recording history to lose access to money that let them buy a couple bags of groceries and make the rent. He condemned these beloved musicians to poverty.

      What happened next is something of a Smurfs Family Christmas miracle.

      24/

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      pluralistic@mamot.fr
      wrote last edited by
      #25

      Musicians were so outraged by this ripoff, and their fans were so outraged on their behalf, that Congress convened a special session solely to repeal the clause that Mitch Glazier tricked them into voting for. Shortly thereafter, Glazier was out of Congress:

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      • pluralistic@mamot.frP pluralistic@mamot.fr

        Musicians were so outraged by this ripoff, and their fans were so outraged on their behalf, that Congress convened a special session solely to repeal the clause that Mitch Glazier tricked them into voting for. Shortly thereafter, Glazier was out of Congress:

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        wrote last edited by
        #26

        But this story has a happy ending for Glazier, too - he might have been out of his government job, but he had a new gig, as CEO of the Recording Industry Association of America, where he earns more than $1.3 million/year to carry on the work he did in Congress - serving the interests of the record labels:

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        Record Industry Association Of America Inc - Nonprofit Explorer - ProPublica

        Since 2013, the IRS has released data culled from millions of nonprofit tax filings. Use this database to find organizations and see details like their executive compensation, revenue and expenses, as well as download tax filings going back as far as 2001.

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        • pluralistic@mamot.frP pluralistic@mamot.fr

          But this story has a happy ending for Glazier, too - he might have been out of his government job, but he had a new gig, as CEO of the Recording Industry Association of America, where he earns more than $1.3 million/year to carry on the work he did in Congress - serving the interests of the record labels:

          Link Preview Image
          Record Industry Association Of America Inc - Nonprofit Explorer - ProPublica

          Since 2013, the IRS has released data culled from millions of nonprofit tax filings. Use this database to find organizations and see details like their executive compensation, revenue and expenses, as well as download tax filings going back as far as 2001.

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          ProPublica (projects.propublica.org)

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          pluralistic@mamot.frP This user is from outside of this forum
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          pluralistic@mamot.fr
          wrote last edited by
          #27

          Mitch Glazier serves the interests of the *labels*, not musicians. He *can't* serve both interests, because every dime a musician takes home is a dime that the labels don't get to realize as profits. Labels and musicians are class enemies. The fact that many musicians are on the labels' side when they sue AI companies *does not* mean that the labels are on the musicians' side.

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          pluralistic@mamot.frP 1 Reply Last reply
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          • pluralistic@mamot.frP pluralistic@mamot.fr

            Mitch Glazier serves the interests of the *labels*, not musicians. He *can't* serve both interests, because every dime a musician takes home is a dime that the labels don't get to realize as profits. Labels and musicians are class enemies. The fact that many musicians are on the labels' side when they sue AI companies *does not* mean that the labels are on the musicians' side.

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            pluralistic@mamot.fr
            wrote last edited by
            #28

            What will the media companies do if they win their suits? Glazier gives us the answer in the opening of his release: they will create "partnerships" with AI companies to train models on the work we produce.

            This is the lesson of the past 40 years of copyright expansion. For 40 years, we have expanded copyright in every way: copyright lasts longer, covers more works, prohibits more uses without licenses, establishes higher penalties, and makes it easier to win those penalties.

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            • pluralistic@mamot.frP pluralistic@mamot.fr

              What will the media companies do if they win their suits? Glazier gives us the answer in the opening of his release: they will create "partnerships" with AI companies to train models on the work we produce.

              This is the lesson of the past 40 years of copyright expansion. For 40 years, we have expanded copyright in every way: copyright lasts longer, covers more works, prohibits more uses without licenses, establishes higher penalties, and makes it easier to win those penalties.

              28/

              pluralistic@mamot.frP This user is from outside of this forum
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              pluralistic@mamot.fr
              wrote last edited by
              #29

              Today, the media industry is larger and more profitable than at any time, *and* the share of those profits that artists take home is smaller than ever.

              How has the expansion of copyright led to media companies getting richer and artists getting poorer? That's the question that Rebecca Giblin and I answer in our 2022 book *Chokepoint Capitalism*.

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              pluralistic@mamot.frP 1 Reply Last reply
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              • pluralistic@mamot.frP pluralistic@mamot.fr

                Today, the media industry is larger and more profitable than at any time, *and* the share of those profits that artists take home is smaller than ever.

                How has the expansion of copyright led to media companies getting richer and artists getting poorer? That's the question that Rebecca Giblin and I answer in our 2022 book *Chokepoint Capitalism*.

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                wrote last edited by
                #30

                In a nutshell: in a world of five publishers, four studios, three labels, two app companies and one company that controls all ebooks and audiobooks, giving a creative worker more copyright is like giving your bullied kid extra lunch money. It doesn't matter how much lunch money you give that kid - the bullies will take it all, and the kid will go hungry:

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                • pluralistic@mamot.frP pluralistic@mamot.fr

                  In a nutshell: in a world of five publishers, four studios, three labels, two app companies and one company that controls all ebooks and audiobooks, giving a creative worker more copyright is like giving your bullied kid extra lunch money. It doesn't matter how much lunch money you give that kid - the bullies will take it all, and the kid will go hungry:

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                  What is Chokepoint Capitalism? – Pluralistic: Daily links from Cory Doctorow

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                  pluralistic@mamot.fr
                  wrote last edited by
                  #31

                  Indeed, if you keep giving that kid more lunch money, the bullies will eventually have enough dough that they'll hire a fancy ad-agency to blitz the world with a campaign insisting that our schoolkids are all going hungry and need *even more* lunch money (they'll take that money, too).

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                  • pluralistic@mamot.frP pluralistic@mamot.fr

                    Indeed, if you keep giving that kid more lunch money, the bullies will eventually have enough dough that they'll hire a fancy ad-agency to blitz the world with a campaign insisting that our schoolkids are all going hungry and need *even more* lunch money (they'll take that money, too).

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                    wrote last edited by
                    #32

                    When Mitch Glazier - who got a $1m+/year job for the labels after attempting to pauperize musicans - writes on behalf of Disney in support of a copyright suit to establish that copyright prevents training a model without a license, he's not defending creative workers.

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                    • pluralistic@mamot.frP pluralistic@mamot.fr

                      When Mitch Glazier - who got a $1m+/year job for the labels after attempting to pauperize musicans - writes on behalf of Disney in support of a copyright suit to establish that copyright prevents training a model without a license, he's not defending creative workers.

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                      wrote last edited by
                      #33

                      Disney is the company that takes the position that if it buys a company like Lucasfilm or Fox, it only acquires the *right* to use the works we made for those companies, but not the *obligation* to pay us when they do:

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                      Pluralistic: 29 Apr 2021 – Pluralistic: Daily links from Cory Doctorow

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                      If a new, unambiguous copyright over model training comes into existence - whether through a court precedent or a new law - then all our contracts will be amended to non-negotiably require us to assign that right to our bosses.

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                      • pluralistic@mamot.frP pluralistic@mamot.fr

                        Disney is the company that takes the position that if it buys a company like Lucasfilm or Fox, it only acquires the *right* to use the works we made for those companies, but not the *obligation* to pay us when they do:

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                        Pluralistic: 29 Apr 2021 – Pluralistic: Daily links from Cory Doctorow

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                        If a new, unambiguous copyright over model training comes into existence - whether through a court precedent or a new law - then all our contracts will be amended to non-negotiably require us to assign that right to our bosses.

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                        pluralistic@mamot.fr
                        wrote last edited by
                        #34

                        And our bosses will enter into "partnerships" to train models on our works. And those models will exist for one purpose: to let them create works without paying us.

                        The market concentration that lets our bosses dictate terms to us is getting *much* worse, and it's only speeding up. Getty Images - who sued Stability AI over image generation - is merging with Shutterstock:

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                        Photographers alarmed by Getty/Shutterstock merger

                        Several photographers have warned that the merger of Getty Images and Shutterstock will result in even smaller commissions for artists, in a deal that could test the Trump Administration's desire to protect labour competition. 

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                        And Paramount is merging with Warners:

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                        Pluralistic: California can stop Larry Ellison from buying Warners (28 Feb 2026) – Pluralistic: Daily links from Cory Doctorow

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                        • pluralistic@mamot.frP pluralistic@mamot.fr

                          And our bosses will enter into "partnerships" to train models on our works. And those models will exist for one purpose: to let them create works without paying us.

                          The market concentration that lets our bosses dictate terms to us is getting *much* worse, and it's only speeding up. Getty Images - who sued Stability AI over image generation - is merging with Shutterstock:

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                          Photographers alarmed by Getty/Shutterstock merger

                          Several photographers have warned that the merger of Getty Images and Shutterstock will result in even smaller commissions for artists, in a deal that could test the Trump Administration's desire to protect labour competition. 

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                          And Paramount is merging with Warners:

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                          Pluralistic: California can stop Larry Ellison from buying Warners (28 Feb 2026) – Pluralistic: Daily links from Cory Doctorow

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                          pluralistic@mamot.fr
                          wrote last edited by
                          #35

                          This is where this new SCOTUS action comes in. A new copyright that covers training is just one more thing these increasingly powerful members of this increasingly incestuous cartel can force us to sign away. That new copyright isn't something for us to bargain *with*, it's something we'll bargain *away*.

                          But the fact that the works that a model produces are automatically in the public domain is something we *can't* bargain away. It's a legal *fact*, not a legal *right*.

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                          • pluralistic@mamot.frP pluralistic@mamot.fr

                            This is where this new SCOTUS action comes in. A new copyright that covers training is just one more thing these increasingly powerful members of this increasingly incestuous cartel can force us to sign away. That new copyright isn't something for us to bargain *with*, it's something we'll bargain *away*.

                            But the fact that the works that a model produces are automatically in the public domain is something we *can't* bargain away. It's a legal *fact*, not a legal *right*.

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                            wrote last edited by
                            #36

                            It means the more humans there are involved in the creation of a work, the more copyrightable the work is.

                            Media bosses love AI because it dangles a tantalizing possibility of running a firm without ego-shattering confrontations with creative workers who know how to do things. It's the solipsistic fantasy of a world without workers, in which a media boss conceives of a "product," prompts a sycophantic AI, and receives an item that's ready for sale:

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                            Pluralistic: A world without people (05 Jan 2026) – Pluralistic: Daily links from Cory Doctorow

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                            • pluralistic@mamot.frP pluralistic@mamot.fr

                              It means the more humans there are involved in the creation of a work, the more copyrightable the work is.

                              Media bosses love AI because it dangles a tantalizing possibility of running a firm without ego-shattering confrontations with creative workers who know how to do things. It's the solipsistic fantasy of a world without workers, in which a media boss conceives of a "product," prompts a sycophantic AI, and receives an item that's ready for sale:

                              Link Preview Image
                              Pluralistic: A world without people (05 Jan 2026) – Pluralistic: Daily links from Cory Doctorow

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                              pluralistic@mamot.fr
                              wrote last edited by
                              #37

                              Many bosses know this isn't within reach. They imagine that they'll get the AI to shit out a script and then pay a writer on the cheap to "polish" it. They think they'll get an AI to shit out a motion sequence, a still, or a 3D model and then pay a human artist pennies to put the "final touches" on it.

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                              • pluralistic@mamot.frP pluralistic@mamot.fr

                                Many bosses know this isn't within reach. They imagine that they'll get the AI to shit out a script and then pay a writer on the cheap to "polish" it. They think they'll get an AI to shit out a motion sequence, a still, or a 3D model and then pay a human artist pennies to put the "final touches" on it.

                                37/

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                                pluralistic@mamot.fr
                                wrote last edited by
                                #38

                                But the Copyright Office's position is that *only* those human contributions are eligible for a copyright: a few editorial changes, a few pixels or vectors rearranged. Everything else is in the public domain.

                                Here's the cool part: the only thing our bosses hate more than paying us is when other people take their stuff without paying for it. To achieve the kind of control they demand, they will have to pay *us* to make creative works.

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                                • pluralistic@mamot.frP pluralistic@mamot.fr

                                  But the Copyright Office's position is that *only* those human contributions are eligible for a copyright: a few editorial changes, a few pixels or vectors rearranged. Everything else is in the public domain.

                                  Here's the cool part: the only thing our bosses hate more than paying us is when other people take their stuff without paying for it. To achieve the kind of control they demand, they will have to pay *us* to make creative works.

                                  38/

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                                  wrote last edited by
                                  #39

                                  What's more, the fact that AI-generated works are in the public domain leaves a lot of uses that *don't* harm creative workers intact. You can amuse yourself and your friends with all the AI slop you can generate; the fact that it's not copyrightable doesn't matter to that use. I happen to think AI "art" is shit, but you do you:

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                                  • pluralistic@mamot.frP pluralistic@mamot.fr

                                    What's more, the fact that AI-generated works are in the public domain leaves a lot of uses that *don't* harm creative workers intact. You can amuse yourself and your friends with all the AI slop you can generate; the fact that it's not copyrightable doesn't matter to that use. I happen to think AI "art" is shit, but you do you:

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                                    Pluralistic: AI “art” and uncanniness (13 May 2024) – Pluralistic: Daily links from Cory Doctorow

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                                    pluralistic@mamot.fr
                                    wrote last edited by
                                    #40

                                    This also means that if you're a writer who likes to brainstorm with a chatbot as you develop an idea, that's fine, so long as the AI's words don't end up in the final product. Creative workers already assemble "mood boards" and clippings for inspiration - so long as these aren't incorporated into the final work, that's fine.

                                    That's just what the Hollywood writers bargained for in their historic strike over AI.

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                                    • pluralistic@mamot.frP pluralistic@mamot.fr

                                      This also means that if you're a writer who likes to brainstorm with a chatbot as you develop an idea, that's fine, so long as the AI's words don't end up in the final product. Creative workers already assemble "mood boards" and clippings for inspiration - so long as these aren't incorporated into the final work, that's fine.

                                      That's just what the Hollywood writers bargained for in their historic strike over AI.

                                      40/

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                                      pluralistic@mamot.fr
                                      wrote last edited by
                                      #41

                                      They retained the right to use AI *if they wanted to*, but their bosses couldn't *force* them to:

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                                      How the Writers Guild sunk AI’s ship – Pluralistic: Daily links from Cory Doctorow

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                                      The Writers Guild were able to bargain with the heavily concentrated studios because they are organized in a union. Not just any union, either: the Writers Guild (along with the other Hollywood unions) are able to undertake "sectoral bargaining" - that's when a union can negotiate a contract with *all* the employers in a sector at once.

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                                      • pluralistic@mamot.frP pluralistic@mamot.fr

                                        They retained the right to use AI *if they wanted to*, but their bosses couldn't *force* them to:

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                                        The Writers Guild were able to bargain with the heavily concentrated studios because they are organized in a union. Not just any union, either: the Writers Guild (along with the other Hollywood unions) are able to undertake "sectoral bargaining" - that's when a union can negotiate a contract with *all* the employers in a sector at once.

                                        41/

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                                        wrote last edited by
                                        #42

                                        Sectoral bargaining was once the standard for labor relations, but it was outlawed in the 1947 Taft-Hartley Act, which clawed back many of the important labor rights established with the New Deal's National Labor Relations Act. To get Taft-Hartley through Congress, its authors had to compromise by grandfathering in the powerful Hollywood unions, who retained their right to sectoral bargaining. More 75 years later, the sectoral bargaining right *still* protects those workers.

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                                        • pluralistic@mamot.frP pluralistic@mamot.fr

                                          Sectoral bargaining was once the standard for labor relations, but it was outlawed in the 1947 Taft-Hartley Act, which clawed back many of the important labor rights established with the New Deal's National Labor Relations Act. To get Taft-Hartley through Congress, its authors had to compromise by grandfathering in the powerful Hollywood unions, who retained their right to sectoral bargaining. More 75 years later, the sectoral bargaining right *still* protects those workers.

                                          42/

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                                          pluralistic@mamot.fr
                                          wrote last edited by
                                          #43

                                          Our bosses tell us that we should side with them in demanding a new law: a copyright law that covers training an AI model. The mere fact that our bosses want this should set off alarm bells. Just because we're on their side, it doesn't mean they're on our side. They are *not*.

                                          If we're going to use our muscle to fight for a new law, let it be a sectoral bargaining law - one that covers *all* workers. Y

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