Car just drove by and one of the guys in it made the 🐈👅 gesture out the window at me.
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@sebastian Your concern for Alice’s wording instead of the messaging says a lot about your priorities and it’s definitely not about Alice’s safety nor anyone else’s who shares this kind of experience about men.
@stephaniepixie
Downloading this image and keeping it for other appropriate occasions. Thank-you. -
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@alice a lot of replies to this make me think that hopefully I'm probably doing the right thing by acting "antisocial" around women in public. I'm gay/queer, but cis and I pass for straight, so I just assume women who don't know me will perceive me as a potential threat. It's fine, my dog and I can step off the sidewalk and give you space.
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With all respect to all participants in any discussion, this is what I consider problematic behaviour. #blockwart
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@Colman one of the insidious things is that it's *so* easy to miss when you're not the target.
Of the 4 people in the car (one girl, 3 guys), only the guy making the gesture, and the guy laughing next to him seemed aware of it. So besides me and the two who found it funny, no one else on that busy street noticed.
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@irene @blainsmith @rbphotographic @alice and here I am trying to figure out non-creepy ways of complimenting my younger but adult ballerina colleagues on their dancing.
@Colman "you are impressively talented", "you are an amazing dancer", "I'm humbled to share a stage with someone who puts in so much effort".
Say it lightly, around other people, and then continue whatever else you were doing and let them decide whether or how to take your compliment. If they chase you up to say thanks, then you did good. If they don't, then you said something kind and that's all there is to it.
I hear a lot of guys saying things like "I don't know how to compliment a woman", and my best answer is that you do it without expecting anything in return. Most people can tell when a compliment is genuine and when it's manipulative.
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@Colman "you are impressively talented", "you are an amazing dancer", "I'm humbled to share a stage with someone who puts in so much effort".
Say it lightly, around other people, and then continue whatever else you were doing and let them decide whether or how to take your compliment. If they chase you up to say thanks, then you did good. If they don't, then you said something kind and that's all there is to it.
I hear a lot of guys saying things like "I don't know how to compliment a woman", and my best answer is that you do it without expecting anything in return. Most people can tell when a compliment is genuine and when it's manipulative.
@alice @Colman @blainsmith @rbphotographic Rule of thumb: comment on things that are changeable and they worked on, like your extension is great or you are looking solid on those turns. Absolutely do not comment on things they cannot control, like you look beautiful or you have lovely legs. For example, sometimes people say to me: you have beautiful hair and it’s weird because like it’s just my hair? What am I suppose to respond, thanks I grew it myself? I also make it a rule not to comment on people’s appearance at work.
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@alice need a gesture that is similar to "I like your shoelaces"
@wbud smiling and waving works pretty well.
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Car just drove by and one of the guys in it made the
gesture out the window at me.Not sure if it was an observation based on my aesthetic, or the threat of a
good time, but either way...guys, this is why y'all're still single.@alice ewww! And men have the gall to ask “why won’t anyone date me!”
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@stephaniepixie
Downloading this image and keeping it for other appropriate occasions. Thank-you.@GinevraCat I’ve had since my days on the bird app and it has come in handy
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@alice @Colman @blainsmith @rbphotographic Rule of thumb: comment on things that are changeable and they worked on, like your extension is great or you are looking solid on those turns. Absolutely do not comment on things they cannot control, like you look beautiful or you have lovely legs. For example, sometimes people say to me: you have beautiful hair and it’s weird because like it’s just my hair? What am I suppose to respond, thanks I grew it myself? I also make it a rule not to comment on people’s appearance at work.
@irene @alice @Colman @blainsmith @rbphotographic Which also relates to a word choice I’ve been trying to be more aware of: talent versus skill. Talent is often considered innate (like “gifted”), while skill is always considered developed.
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@alice a lot of replies to this make me think that hopefully I'm probably doing the right thing by acting "antisocial" around women in public. I'm gay/queer, but cis and I pass for straight, so I just assume women who don't know me will perceive me as a potential threat. It's fine, my dog and I can step off the sidewalk and give you space.
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@alice @spiegelmama @Aprazeth Mike Harriot has a pretty good way of shutting up the "not all men" or the "not all white people" crowd.
Paraphrasing, if I say "Elephants trampled my grandma to death," it would be idiotic to say "Well not ALL elephants trampled your memaw!" And that's true. It wasn't all elephants; it was elephants. I'm not saying all elephants are dangerous; I'm saying elephants are dangerous.
Also, if someone said "Elephants trampled my grandma to death", it would be very strange to say anything but "Oh no, that's terrible!"
And yet…
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@alice need a gesture that is similar to "I like your shoelaces"
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@Colman "you are impressively talented", "you are an amazing dancer", "I'm humbled to share a stage with someone who puts in so much effort".
Say it lightly, around other people, and then continue whatever else you were doing and let them decide whether or how to take your compliment. If they chase you up to say thanks, then you did good. If they don't, then you said something kind and that's all there is to it.
I hear a lot of guys saying things like "I don't know how to compliment a woman", and my best answer is that you do it without expecting anything in return. Most people can tell when a compliment is genuine and when it's manipulative.
@alice @Colman @irene @blainsmith @rbphotographic
As an older guy who works with a lot of younger women, if I ever give them a compliment it is a completely neutral phrase like "you look amazing". No implication of attraction involved. "You look great" seems safe. What do you think?
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@alice @Colman @irene @blainsmith @rbphotographic
As an older guy who works with a lot of younger women, if I ever give them a compliment it is a completely neutral phrase like "you look amazing". No implication of attraction involved. "You look great" seems safe. What do you think?
@negative12dollarbill @alice @irene @blainsmith @rbphotographic I also have the disability of being brought up in London and Ireland in the 70s so compliments are a foreign language to start with.
Also, keep in mind that they are scantily dressed so I'm definitely safest not noticing anything about their appearance!
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@GinevraCat I’ve had since my days on the bird app and it has come in handy
@stephaniepixie
Brilliant. -
@alice
Ok
Old Guy hereALL men have been and are likely to be guilty of some degree of this, and ALL men need to step up and ~police themselves~ AND ~Police other men~
Add this as a duty to be performed on a regular basisIf you suddenly have an urge to shout "not me" or "not all men", suck that neck back in, and know that 100% you are trying to fool us, or fool yourself.
None of us are immune to this, and all of us need to do the effort to curb itStart now
@screwturn @alice This resonates. Another Old Guy here. I'm pretty sure I have never been The Problem (though I realize final judgement on that is not mine to make), but I have definitely been present when other men WERE the problem, and through some combination of my lack of awareness, lack of understanding, lack of surety (will I help or further harm by speaking out? will I be seen as trying to White Knight if I do?), and lack of courage, failed to address the problem.
1/3
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@screwturn @alice This resonates. Another Old Guy here. I'm pretty sure I have never been The Problem (though I realize final judgement on that is not mine to make), but I have definitely been present when other men WERE the problem, and through some combination of my lack of awareness, lack of understanding, lack of surety (will I help or further harm by speaking out? will I be seen as trying to White Knight if I do?), and lack of courage, failed to address the problem.
1/3
@screwturn @alice One day at a convention, I went utterly south on this pervy motherfucker trying to hit on my sixteen year old daughter. It was ugly. Years later my daughter told me that my reaction was the only reason she remembered the interaction at all. Before I stuck my nose in, this miserable fuck was just another day of being "a girl in public."
That kinda spun me, and I thought about so many times I'd been witness to the shittiness men are capable of.
2/3
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@screwturn @alice One day at a convention, I went utterly south on this pervy motherfucker trying to hit on my sixteen year old daughter. It was ugly. Years later my daughter told me that my reaction was the only reason she remembered the interaction at all. Before I stuck my nose in, this miserable fuck was just another day of being "a girl in public."
That kinda spun me, and I thought about so many times I'd been witness to the shittiness men are capable of.
2/3
@screwturn @alice I'd like to think I've done better since, been more aware, more understanding, learned some ways to help, been more courageous. Been more aware of the ways in which I am, however unintentionally, part of the problem. Again, not for me to judge whether or not I've succeeded. Certainly haven't writ-large. But I continue to try. I'm at least more aware.
3/3
