For the past year or so, I’ve been using and enjoying the search engine Kagi.
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@inthehands @glightly@mastodon.social @CptSuperlative one thing I've been thinking about—a tangent to this tangent—is an updated take on the old webrings. For blogs and other websites, using some kind of combination of tags, pingbacks, and algorithms to generate recommendations and related links. One of the things I miss the most about the old timey web is the feeling of "surfing"—not just getting a stream of content from a central feed, but chains of association. I still get it from Wikipedia, and that's it
@inthehands @glightly@mastodon.social @CptSuperlative so you'd sign up to some sort of community maintained webring server, implement an API, and get dynamic lists of links to put on your pages to pages from other sites in the "ring"
Plus there'd be a directory
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@glightly@mastodon.social @inthehands @CptSuperlative Google dit kill that project. Name is escaping m'y memory search. I participantes, but fighting spam there was hard, as well as maintaining links
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@inthehands @glightly@mastodon.social @CptSuperlative so you'd sign up to some sort of community maintained webring server, implement an API, and get dynamic lists of links to put on your pages to pages from other sites in the "ring"
Plus there'd be a directory
@alter_kaker @glightly@mastodon.social @CptSuperlative I’d even be happy with this as a non-API-driven, non-dynamic, manually authored thing that people just toss on the personal blogs they’re now resurrecting.
Web comics folks often still do this. Note for example QC’s “other good comics” links smack dab in the right margin, taking up space on every page: https://www.questionablecontent.net
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@glightly@mastodon.social Sorry for the jargon in your mentions! The simple version is just “people should mutually link to each others’ personal web sites more, that would be cool.”
And I’ll be sure to un-CC you from any further technical replies.
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@CptSuperlative @noodlejetski @inthehands Since it's 100% dependant on a popular google product, it can hardly be considered an alternative to it. Vivaldi is repackaged chromium, just like most other browsers. There are very good add ons for firefox for tab management btw.. I use "tab session manager".
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@JessTheUnstill @inthehands
Additionally most of the tech exists because of "politics"
Thinking e.g. of the military funding of the ARPANETOne could say, without politics there is no innovation
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@glightly@mastodon.social I'm sorry to ping again, but do note that you can disable notifications for just one conversation in the context menu of any incoming notification. I use it all the time and its super handy for situations lime these
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Search is a wasteland right now. Alas. And there are no good choices.
But look, if I’m going to •pay• a company money for search, it needs to be a company run by ethically mature people. If and when Kagi is run by such people, maybe I’ll give that paid plan another go. For now, well, maybe these childish people will blunder their way to maturity and maybe they’ll just blunder, but either way, they won’t be doing it on my dime.
/end
Maaaaan, what a disappointing thread to stumble across not an hour after I was just thinking, "Geeze I've been on Kagi for half a year and I don't miss google a bit! Totally worth the price!"
I'm conflicted; search being good is really important for me both personally and professionally, but...yeah that's a disappointing response. Heck, they could've probably come up with a technical solution like an opt-out or something that would've at least...mitigated, but they just doubled down.
I wish somebody would see this as a chance to swoop in and duplicate Kagi's business model / basic concept but with a bit of "don't be evil" principle mixed in. At least maybe they'd be good for 5-10 years before they turned to the dark side.
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@ChildlessBambino@mastodon.green After leaving Kagi a couple days ago, I'm doing the same as you are. So far, that works for me.
I'm also glad to see Mojeek here on Mastodon: @Mojeek
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@jollyorc Another ex-Kagi user here. I'm trying out Mojeek and also using DuckDuckGo at times. Not as nice an answer as Kagi was, but no affiliation with Brave.
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@ChildlessBambino@mastodon.green After leaving Kagi a couple days ago, I'm doing the same as you are. So far, that works for me.
I'm also glad to see Mojeek here on Mastodon: @Mojeek
@jeridansky @ChildlessBambino@mastodon.green best place to be, hands down.
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@wonkothesane @mattly @inthehands yeah, kinda sad how that "shoving" comment is still there, but Vlad has been removing any new comments and just directs people to DM him instead. saw a thread where two people were criticizing the company's response disappear before my eyes last night.
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For the past year or so, I’ve been using and enjoying the search engine Kagi. Its search results are…fine, no worse than others, and it’s ad-free, stated privacy as a primary goal, and seemed to have a better ethical sense than its competitors.
Or so I hoped.
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@inthehands I'm not sure I understand the part where you start rejecting people because they reject people. For me, the more general view is to hope to include everyone. That's not possible, I know. But in order to be inclusive, I feel an obligation to try to be inclusive. Yeah, that includes idiots, bigots, users of Kagi and haters of it too and also people who just don't care. I hope you feel welcome, too.
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Search is a wasteland right now. Alas. And there are no good choices.
But look, if I’m going to •pay• a company money for search, it needs to be a company run by ethically mature people. If and when Kagi is run by such people, maybe I’ll give that paid plan another go. For now, well, maybe these childish people will blunder their way to maturity and maybe they’ll just blunder, but either way, they won’t be doing it on my dime.
/end
@inthehands What's most disappointing here is the lack of seeing how this clashes with #Kagi 's supposed mission of "humanizing the web".
You can't do that while pretending ethics aren't part of it. Or by defending your business relationship with someone who denies basic human rights to some.
I think it'd be recoverable for Kagi if they end up revisiting the issue, but right now, I'm disappointed a.f.
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@phiofx@hachyderm.io Ohhh. Internet search as a public trust?
An org like the Sovereign Tech Fund or the Prototype Fund might actually sponsor that.
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Search is a wasteland right now. Alas. And there are no good choices.
But look, if I’m going to •pay• a company money for search, it needs to be a company run by ethically mature people. If and when Kagi is run by such people, maybe I’ll give that paid plan another go. For now, well, maybe these childish people will blunder their way to maturity and maybe they’ll just blunder, but either way, they won’t be doing it on my dime.
/end
@inthehands Thanks for this insightful thread. I’ve also been trying out Kagi this last couple of months, and been happy with it, but did not know about this thing with Brave. Disappointing to see them going down this path.
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@CptSuperlative
Thank you. I guess I can see the appeal and decreased resource usage compared to keeping all those open in separate windows
@inthehands -
@inthehands I'm not sure I understand the part where you start rejecting people because they reject people. For me, the more general view is to hope to include everyone. That's not possible, I know. But in order to be inclusive, I feel an obligation to try to be inclusive. Yeah, that includes idiots, bigots, users of Kagi and haters of it too and also people who just don't care. I hope you feel welcome, too.
@valentyn @inthehands
> I'm not sure I understand the part where you start rejecting people because they reject peoplelook up "paradox of tolerance".
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My dude, politics were deeply intertwined with tech long before I wrote my first line of code back in 1982. You don’t get to opt out. That choice isn’t even on the table. You interact with humans, you interact with politics.
Vlad’s post is a historically ignorant, pants-on-head-stupid answer to a serious question. When I read it, I hear, “We’re not ethically mature enough to think about our social responsibility, so we’ve given ourselves permission to take no responsibility at all.”
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My favourite tech-in-politics is from early 19th century. It was against custom to work on Sundays -- even tending your home garden might have been verboten -- but it was illogical to shut down the steam engines for one day a week, so if you wanted to keep your work, you came to work when the roster asked.
Later they "compromised" and gave half a day free.
(In agriculture, divisions between work and free time were not as strick.)
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@valentyn @inthehands
> I'm not sure I understand the part where you start rejecting people because they reject peoplelook up "paradox of tolerance".
@noodlejetski @inthehands being intolerant to intolerance isn't the same as being intolerant to people being intolerant. Also, Popper talked about society as a whole. I just don't think rejection of certain humans helps society.
Although I'm not sure if that's still helpful once a society already has become intolerant.
Intolerance towards indifference just doesn't help indifference, it will only help intolerance.
