So it turns out that having the most *expensive* military tech in the world may not be the best strategy, huh?
-
Also, I suspect the US is going to turn out to not be as well-armed or prepared as they think because in Trump's kleptocracy, you gotta think some wild corruption is going to come to light & some armaments that are supposed to be there aren't & some equipment that is supposed to work doesn't.
Theft. Fraud. Graft. Cutting corners. It's a mess for sure.
@artemis Even if the US military is as heavily armed as it's meant to be - they were for korea, vietnam, iraq, iraq again, afghanistan, etc. too.
The US can be heavily armed and still get it's ass kicked. -
Also, I suspect the US is going to turn out to not be as well-armed or prepared as they think because in Trump's kleptocracy, you gotta think some wild corruption is going to come to light & some armaments that are supposed to be there aren't & some equipment that is supposed to work doesn't.
Theft. Fraud. Graft. Cutting corners. It's a mess for sure.
Would you honestly believe that there is a single part of the federal government that is not currently being stripped for parts & sold off? Is there a single part that isn't filthy with fraud & bribes & payouts?
They have been destroying the ground beneath their (and our) feet for a while.
-
So it turns out that having the most *expensive* military tech in the world may not be the best strategy, huh?
Who could have known that having very expensive equipment & arms/ammunition that take a long time to make might not be an advantage?
@artemis see also Millennium Challenge 2002.
US forces get roasted in a wargame by an opposing force using unconventional tactics, pentagon brass declared unconventional tactics against the rules and declares that they won anyway.
-
@artemis Even if the US military is as heavily armed as it's meant to be - they were for korea, vietnam, iraq, iraq again, afghanistan, etc. too.
The US can be heavily armed and still get it's ass kicked.@miss_rodent
Hundred percent. But I am pretty sure the whole federal government is hollow now, so this is going to go even worse. -
The Trump administration is possibly the most hopped-up on their own propaganda administration the US has ever seen. These people are drunk on it.
They think they have a literally invincible army, & they believe that it is impossible for white people to lose to brown folks (among many, many other false beliefs that are going to kick them in the ass).
@artemis Yeah, but I'm still waiting for them to get to the “find out" part.
-
So it turns out that having the most *expensive* military tech in the world may not be the best strategy, huh?
Who could have known that having very expensive equipment & arms/ammunition that take a long time to make might not be an advantage?
@artemis I believe Arthur C. Clarke wrote a short story about this back in the 50s -- "Supremacy" or something like that. (I looked it up recently, can find it again if you're curious.)
-
Would you honestly believe that there is a single part of the federal government that is not currently being stripped for parts & sold off? Is there a single part that isn't filthy with fraud & bribes & payouts?
They have been destroying the ground beneath their (and our) feet for a while.
Frankly, the entire military-industrial complex IS a con. That huge military budget sure has gone to a lot of boondoggles & overpriced crap, huh?
This has been true for a while, but just like everything else right now, we are reaching the point where the bottom is going to fall out because everything has been so eroded over time.
-
@miss_rodent
Hundred percent. But I am pretty sure the whole federal government is hollow now, so this is going to go even worse.@artemis Fair. There's been issues with contractors and suppliers taking advantage of US military contracts for decades, which I imagine has only gotten worse.
Like, an ex of mine use to talk about how they weren't allowed to maintain a lot of their own equipment when she was stationed in the middle east for the forever wars - they had to get an approved maintainer through the contracted company to do repairs and shit (at high cost, often slow).
Which seems... absurd to me. -
Since he keeps up on all this stuff & has knowledge of naval operations, spouse has a pretty good idea of what the Navy is capable of, & he thinks the US is pretty much fucked when it comes to the Straits of Hormuz.
They didn't even THINK about this once before doing it.
@artemis The people doing the thinking want to weaken democracy worldwide, which means weaking nominally democratic governments worldwide -- which means weakening the US military, which is still not directly under the control of POTUS nor even the Wall Street oligarchy, is consistent with their goals.
-
Frankly, the entire military-industrial complex IS a con. That huge military budget sure has gone to a lot of boondoggles & overpriced crap, huh?
This has been true for a while, but just like everything else right now, we are reaching the point where the bottom is going to fall out because everything has been so eroded over time.
The US is a hollow nation. Hollowed out over decades. In the coming years, everyone is about to find out that there is not much left.
We haven't quite reached the point where they try to strip the last of the drapes & furniture out of the White House to sell, but it feels like we're close, doesn't it? They are stealing & grifting absolutely anything & everything that they can.
-
@artemis Fair. There's been issues with contractors and suppliers taking advantage of US military contracts for decades, which I imagine has only gotten worse.
Like, an ex of mine use to talk about how they weren't allowed to maintain a lot of their own equipment when she was stationed in the middle east for the forever wars - they had to get an approved maintainer through the contracted company to do repairs and shit (at high cost, often slow).
Which seems... absurd to me.@miss_rodent
Yep. The corruption isn't new. Just worse than ever! -
@woozle
I would be interested. -
@artemis Fair. There's been issues with contractors and suppliers taking advantage of US military contracts for decades, which I imagine has only gotten worse.
Like, an ex of mine use to talk about how they weren't allowed to maintain a lot of their own equipment when she was stationed in the middle east for the forever wars - they had to get an approved maintainer through the contracted company to do repairs and shit (at high cost, often slow).
Which seems... absurd to me.@artemis (also, the "american system" of manufacturing was literally designed around preventing exactly that sort of problem...
*in 1820* yet, here we are again, somehow.) -
So it turns out that having the most *expensive* military tech in the world may not be the best strategy, huh?
Who could have known that having very expensive equipment & arms/ammunition that take a long time to make might not be an advantage?
@artemis i was watching a video on how well the US tanks were doing in Ukraine. Aside from the fact 90+% of them have been destroyed, one little nugget of info made me understand so much about US military doctrine and it's overwhelming weakness.
An M1 Abrams tank, if you fill the fuel tank in the morning, and it sits idling all day (to power target systems and weapons etc...) by sundown the tank is empty, even if it doesn't move. How do you provide the logistics for that madness ?!??
-
Frankly, the entire military-industrial complex IS a con. That huge military budget sure has gone to a lot of boondoggles & overpriced crap, huh?
This has been true for a while, but just like everything else right now, we are reaching the point where the bottom is going to fall out because everything has been so eroded over time.
@artemis I've heard that the pattern with really powerful empires (Heinlein described them as "water empires", but I think we fit the pattern one way or another) is that they erode from within until they are so weak that the smallest push from outside can topple them. (I'm given to understand that this is what happened to the Romans.)
-
Frankly, the entire military-industrial complex IS a con. That huge military budget sure has gone to a lot of boondoggles & overpriced crap, huh?
This has been true for a while, but just like everything else right now, we are reaching the point where the bottom is going to fall out because everything has been so eroded over time.
@artemis Oh, it always has been. See also the F-104 Starfighter.
That plane was so bad it got the nickname "widowmaker" from the Germans because so many pilots died flying them. The reputation was so bad that the US (or Lockheed?) paid for an entire Top Gun knock-off movie to be made about them to try and salvage their reputation.
Fix the problems? No. Just make a movie about how awesome our fancy plane is.
-
Iran appears to be using shortwave radio to send cyphered messages. It's an old school Soviet method of communication. And guess what? It works. None of it goes through a computer, so there is nothing to hack. It's inexpensive & easy to do, & you can just keep changing frequencies when your opponents start interfering with the one you're using.
All the fancy spy equipment the US has? Not meant to deal with that simple, low-tech tactic.
@artemis Also, it doesn't have to be old tech, or even non-digital, to be decisive: see, for example, how Ukraine has been using drones against the Russians.
(This also relates to a 1988 SF novel (I'm fulla those, aren't I) -- David's Sling -- about a battle to convince the US military to use mass-produced cheap weaponry when their entire model is based around gigacontracts handed out as political favors. #TASAT)
-
@woozle
I would be interested. -
@artemis Oh, it always has been. See also the F-104 Starfighter.
That plane was so bad it got the nickname "widowmaker" from the Germans because so many pilots died flying them. The reputation was so bad that the US (or Lockheed?) paid for an entire Top Gun knock-off movie to be made about them to try and salvage their reputation.
Fix the problems? No. Just make a movie about how awesome our fancy plane is.
@faithisleaping @artemis any time a general beats the US in a wargame by something as simple as relaying intel on bikes or something his side gets handicapped so hard in order to get an egostroking US victory, so no one actually sees how to fight
-
Okay, okay, one more example, just for fun.
The sober comment of a NATO commander afterwards: “We’re fucked.”
Exercise: Ukrainian drone pilots wipe out NATO battalions
During the "Hedgehog 2025" exercise in Estonia, NATO troops were clearly shown their limits in a duel with Ukrainian drone teams.
Militär Aktuell – Militär News & Analysen zu internationalen Krisen, Streitkräften & der Defence-Industrie (militaeraktuell.at)
US has burned through ‘years’ of munitions since start of Iran war
Rapid depletion of stockpile including Tomahawk missiles raises pressure on Trump over cost of conflict
