AI Controls (formerly 'kill switch') are landing in today's Firefox Nightly, and will land with Firefox 148 later this month.
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@froztbyte @barubary user research has been carried out, so repeating it doesn't seem necessary at this stage. I've been asking if there are details I can share publicly, but I haven't heard back.
@jaffathecake @froztbyte @barubary what I'm hearing here is "the correct reaction is to harass every single person involved in this debacle until they're too afraid to pull more of this shit"
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@fasterandworse @duke_of_germany @firefoxwebdevs let me be absolutely clear, yet again: I do not consider the arguments being presented here to be irrational.
If you feel I've said that, can you point to where?
@jaffathecake @duke_of_germany @firefoxwebdevs
you said that it's not really useful to know that people who don't like AI don't like AI
and then you said:
> To be clear, I'm not someone who has personally found AI generally useful in browsers (aside from a couple of one-off automations), but my feelings aren't strong enough to deny those features to others.
Jake Archibald (@jaffathecake@mastodon.social)
@froztbyte I suppose that's literally true. But, I also think a mountain is made out of the molehill that is AI in Firefox. The vast majority of the dev time is on other things. To be clear, I'm not someone who has personally found AI generally useful in browsers (aside from a couple of one-off automations), but my feelings aren't strong enough to deny those features to others.
Mastodon (mastodon.social)
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@jaffathecake @duke_of_germany @firefoxwebdevs
you said that it's not really useful to know that people who don't like AI don't like AI
and then you said:
> To be clear, I'm not someone who has personally found AI generally useful in browsers (aside from a couple of one-off automations), but my feelings aren't strong enough to deny those features to others.
Jake Archibald (@jaffathecake@mastodon.social)
@froztbyte I suppose that's literally true. But, I also think a mountain is made out of the molehill that is AI in Firefox. The vast majority of the dev time is on other things. To be clear, I'm not someone who has personally found AI generally useful in browsers (aside from a couple of one-off automations), but my feelings aren't strong enough to deny those features to others.
Mastodon (mastodon.social)
@fasterandworse @duke_of_germany which part of that is calling people irrational?
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@ada 147 isn't considered heavy weighted. Have you tried running without extensions to see if the issue is there?
@firefoxwebdevs
That's the first tying tried. The app works perfectly fine with or without but only when opening the tab list it differs from long delay.I have tested with over 100 tabs in version 12x and it is still snappier than 147 with less than 50 tabs.
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@firefoxwebdevs
That's the first tying tried. The app works perfectly fine with or without but only when opening the tab list it differs from long delay.I have tested with over 100 tabs in version 12x and it is still snappier than 147 with less than 50 tabs.
@ada would you feel comfortable filing a bug report about this on https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/home?
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@giacomo @alextecplayz none of the current AI features are involved in opening a new tab.
@firefoxwebdevs@mastodon.social
Sorry: I was talking about creating a new tab group, obviously.
@alextecplayz@techhub.social
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@fasterandworse @duke_of_germany which part of that is calling people irrational?
@jaffathecake @duke_of_germany Jake, let me be absolutely clear, yet again. The pushback has not been against AI, it has been against AI being integrated into Firefox. Every time you say these things which continue to ignore this distinction you are gaslighting our positions into being some kind of irrational request that breaks the laws of physics and not something that is completely rational and worthy of an honest response.
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@jaffathecake @duke_of_germany Jake, let me be absolutely clear, yet again. The pushback has not been against AI, it has been against AI being integrated into Firefox. Every time you say these things which continue to ignore this distinction you are gaslighting our positions into being some kind of irrational request that breaks the laws of physics and not something that is completely rational and worthy of an honest response.
@fasterandworse @duke_of_germany let me be absolutely clear, yet again: I do not consider the arguments being presented here to be irrational or crazy.
One guy directly compared me to a rapist today. I felt that was irrational, but I don't think that's what we're referring to
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@liquor_american @jaffathecake @duke_of_germany @firefoxwebdevs @davidgerard
What Jake has done here — perhaps this was his goal — is change the topic of the discussion from "Does AI belong in Firefox?" to an increasingly recondite and trivial row over who said what and why are they acting this way. I guess one might call this artful deflection. But it actually looks like somebody ducking the hard question. "Naa naa naa, I can't hear you!" crowed Jake's subconscious. Verbatim.
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@firefoxwebdevs@mastodon.social
Sorry: I was talking about creating a new tab group, obviously.
@alextecplayz@techhub.social@giacomo @alextecplayz ok. Some features of video calling (watching, chatting) are available without granting microphone access, but maybe location access is a better example.
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AI Controls (formerly 'kill switch') are landing in today's Firefox Nightly, and will land with Firefox 148 later this month.
For the full details, see the Firefox blog https://blog.mozilla.org/en/firefox/ai-controls/
@firefoxwebdevs Question: did Mozilla heard and considered 966 answers (on their own blog, so not so fedi biased) and why not?
https://connect.mozilla.org/t5/discussions/building-ai-the-firefox-way-shaping-what-s-next-together/m-p/113012 -
@firefoxwebdevs@mastodon.social
So people can trigger a download by error clicking on that huge popup wide button, right?
Isn't that a well studied example of #DarkPattern?
How many times such button will be shown? Each time a user create a new tab or only the first time?
Each time you raise the probability of erroneous click!
Please make these #AI enhancements fully opt-in.@giacomo @firefoxwebdevs I detailed how Mozilla uses dark patterns in Link Previews to get people to enable AI: https://www.quippd.com/writing/2026/01/06/architecting-consent-for-ai-deceptive-patterns-in-firefox-link-previews.html
You may enjoy reading it.
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@ambiguous_yelp @firefoxwebdevs I was convinced the damage is irreparable. Wasn't everything just deleted?
@nieuemma @ambiguous_yelp @firefoxwebdevs Well, unlike what they are doing elsewhere, there is an edit history. They could go back.
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AI Controls (formerly 'kill switch') are landing in today's Firefox Nightly, and will land with Firefox 148 later this month.
For the full details, see the Firefox blog https://blog.mozilla.org/en/firefox/ai-controls/
@firefoxwebdevs Make it an optional extension.
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Stop portraying Mastodon users as the "anti-AI crazies".
Instead, ask yourself: "What is the relation between Mastodon users & Firefox?"
The answer:
An overwhelming number of Mastodon users used to be your champions.
They are tech people who used to recommend Firefox to the normies in their life. A crowd of mini-influencers, recommending your product.
And I don't understand why you go out of your way to alienate exactly these people.
@da_667
Wow, this quickly became a shit show. -
@jaffathecake @froztbyte exactly the same. You don't go around the ethical problem of the absence of authorship by invoking pathos (and borrowing legitimacy from disabled folks is morally sketchy to put it mildly).
Even more so as available technologies are far remote from being able to convey intent, context and nuance. This is misplaced half-baked solutionism.
@ddelemeny @jaffathecake @froztbyte Why do these creeps routinely weaponize users with accessibility needs to make their case when those users on balance are also *against* this shit?
This is so damn intellectually dishonest. Every time I see it in some AI Bro's socail media thread, youtube comments, etc people who use accessibility tools state definitely to not use them to make their case.
And yet you assholes won't stop. And you get furious when someone supposedly puts words in your mouth!
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@ddelemeny @jaffathecake @froztbyte Why do these creeps routinely weaponize users with accessibility needs to make their case when those users on balance are also *against* this shit?
This is so damn intellectually dishonest. Every time I see it in some AI Bro's socail media thread, youtube comments, etc people who use accessibility tools state definitely to not use them to make their case.
And yet you assholes won't stop. And you get furious when someone supposedly puts words in your mouth!
@reflex @ddelemeny @froztbyte There's no dishonesty here. Using a local model to help with alt text in PDFs is one of the features controlled by Firefox's AI control, so it's relevant to the topic.
I asked a clarifying question and got an answer.
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@ddelemeny @jaffathecake @froztbyte Why do these creeps routinely weaponize users with accessibility needs to make their case when those users on balance are also *against* this shit?
This is so damn intellectually dishonest. Every time I see it in some AI Bro's socail media thread, youtube comments, etc people who use accessibility tools state definitely to not use them to make their case.
And yet you assholes won't stop. And you get furious when someone supposedly puts words in your mouth!
@reflex @ddelemeny @jaffathecake @froztbyte they want to keep framing this as a deliberation over the merits of individual features instead of a, pretty straight forward, push for a separation of concerns between a web browser and extensions
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@reflex @ddelemeny @froztbyte There's no dishonesty here. Using a local model to help with alt text in PDFs is one of the features controlled by Firefox's AI control, so it's relevant to the topic.
I asked a clarifying question and got an answer.
@jaffathecake @reflex @ddelemeny jake, I want to make a bit of a weird comparison here (and I beg that you please understand that this is not a threat or anything but a comparative reference)
do you _get_ that if all these conversations were happening in, like, a bar or something, a number of people would by now have asked to have you thrown out? your persistence in reply framing and what you take from posts comes across.... "obstinate" is the best word I can think of
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@reflex @ddelemeny @froztbyte There's no dishonesty here. Using a local model to help with alt text in PDFs is one of the features controlled by Firefox's AI control, so it's relevant to the topic.
I asked a clarifying question and got an answer.
@jaffathecake @ddelemeny @froztbyte It is dishonest to repeatedly frame your points from the view of marginalized people who did NOT ask you to champion them, and who have an entirely different set of concerns that Mozilla has barely ever recognized or focused on.
If Mozilla actually cared about accessibility, they would focus on accessibility, not scapegoat it as a marketing tool for something else they have decided to do against user wishes.
