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  3. Abandon the em-dash in your human writing?

Abandon the em-dash in your human writing?

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  • zeldman@front-end.socialZ zeldman@front-end.social

    Abandon the em-dash in your human writing?

    The irony—and it’s a big irony—is that real writers use em-dash frequently, and for reasons. As a written signifier of verbal speech pauses, it means something different than what commas and semicolons mean. It connects while separating.

    That’s why so many writers use em-dash when it is the best mark for the job. And chatbots use it because they were schooled on millions of writers.

    1/3

    djvdq@mastodon.socialD This user is from outside of this forum
    djvdq@mastodon.socialD This user is from outside of this forum
    djvdq@mastodon.social
    wrote last edited by
    #6

    @zeldman I stopped using them, even though I really like them. I did that after I was called bot 1 or 2 times, just because of them in my post or comment (don't remember now, but it doesn't matter)

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    • zeldman@front-end.socialZ zeldman@front-end.social

      Afterthought: Ultimately, the best defense is to write well. Write humanly. The closer you make it to that aim, the fewer the folks who will worry about the AI-or-human provenance of your words.

      Saved here: https://zeldman.com/2026/03/24/dine-n-em-dash/

      iwein@mas.toI This user is from outside of this forum
      iwein@mas.toI This user is from outside of this forum
      iwein@mas.to
      wrote last edited by
      #7

      @zeldman well said! ✌️AI✌️ will never catch up with the evolution of our languages—as long as we keep creatively using all registers of our minds .

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      • zeldman@front-end.socialZ zeldman@front-end.social

        Afterthought: Ultimately, the best defense is to write well. Write humanly. The closer you make it to that aim, the fewer the folks who will worry about the AI-or-human provenance of your words.

        Saved here: https://zeldman.com/2026/03/24/dine-n-em-dash/

        suethepooh@mastodon.socialS This user is from outside of this forum
        suethepooh@mastodon.socialS This user is from outside of this forum
        suethepooh@mastodon.social
        wrote last edited by
        #8

        @zeldman i learned american punctuation in school. then i worked on an online training platform and was instructed to change the content to uk punctuation. now i don't know what i'm doing.

        michellebacon@mstdn.socialM 1 Reply Last reply
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        • zeldman@front-end.socialZ zeldman@front-end.social

          Afterthought: Ultimately, the best defense is to write well. Write humanly. The closer you make it to that aim, the fewer the folks who will worry about the AI-or-human provenance of your words.

          Saved here: https://zeldman.com/2026/03/24/dine-n-em-dash/

          erikvorhes@typo.socialE This user is from outside of this forum
          erikvorhes@typo.socialE This user is from outside of this forum
          erikvorhes@typo.social
          wrote last edited by
          #9

          @zeldman — well put! The struggle to rise above the slop-infested waters is real, especially when LLMs appropriate some of our handy rhetorical tools.

          erikvorhes@typo.socialE 1 Reply Last reply
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          • erikvorhes@typo.socialE erikvorhes@typo.social

            @zeldman — well put! The struggle to rise above the slop-infested waters is real, especially when LLMs appropriate some of our handy rhetorical tools.

            erikvorhes@typo.socialE This user is from outside of this forum
            erikvorhes@typo.socialE This user is from outside of this forum
            erikvorhes@typo.social
            wrote last edited by
            #10

            @zeldman — also, a pox on LLMs for ruining the “begin with a complementary phatic utterance” trope.

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            • zeldman@front-end.socialZ zeldman@front-end.social

              Abandon the em-dash in your human writing?

              The irony—and it’s a big irony—is that real writers use em-dash frequently, and for reasons. As a written signifier of verbal speech pauses, it means something different than what commas and semicolons mean. It connects while separating.

              That’s why so many writers use em-dash when it is the best mark for the job. And chatbots use it because they were schooled on millions of writers.

              1/3

              trainguyrom@techhub.socialT This user is from outside of this forum
              trainguyrom@techhub.socialT This user is from outside of this forum
              trainguyrom@techhub.social
              wrote last edited by
              #11

              @zeldman oh shit that's what the em-dash is for! I've always used parentheses but knew it was wrong! Welp, I guess that's a handy nugget of knowledge for 5-10 years from now when AI has passed out of the collective forethought of humanity

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              • zeldman@front-end.socialZ zeldman@front-end.social

                Abandon the em-dash in your human writing?

                The irony—and it’s a big irony—is that real writers use em-dash frequently, and for reasons. As a written signifier of verbal speech pauses, it means something different than what commas and semicolons mean. It connects while separating.

                That’s why so many writers use em-dash when it is the best mark for the job. And chatbots use it because they were schooled on millions of writers.

                1/3

                amber@front-end.socialA This user is from outside of this forum
                amber@front-end.socialA This user is from outside of this forum
                amber@front-end.social
                wrote last edited by
                #12

                @zeldman I've replaced my em-dash with a normal dash so people know i'm smart enough to use em-dashes - but it's dumb enough not to be AI since it's the incorrect symbol lol

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                • peach@phpc.socialP peach@phpc.social

                  @zeldman ever since I saw an excellent talk by @malarkey on the use of em dashes, en dashes, and even the hairline spaces between, I've loved using them.

                  I wont give that up for anything. haha.

                  (im probably miss-using them most of the time though)

                  rndanger@infosec.exchangeR This user is from outside of this forum
                  rndanger@infosec.exchangeR This user is from outside of this forum
                  rndanger@infosec.exchange
                  wrote last edited by
                  #13

                  @peach @zeldman @malarkey
                  Two thoughts on misusing punctuation: 1. Practices establish norms. 2. The function of a system is what it does

                  Use them wrong long enough and it may become right

                  1 Reply Last reply
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                  • zeldman@front-end.socialZ zeldman@front-end.social

                    Abandon the em-dash in your human writing?

                    The irony—and it’s a big irony—is that real writers use em-dash frequently, and for reasons. As a written signifier of verbal speech pauses, it means something different than what commas and semicolons mean. It connects while separating.

                    That’s why so many writers use em-dash when it is the best mark for the job. And chatbots use it because they were schooled on millions of writers.

                    1/3

                    thesquirrelfish@sfba.socialT This user is from outside of this forum
                    thesquirrelfish@sfba.socialT This user is from outside of this forum
                    thesquirrelfish@sfba.social
                    wrote last edited by
                    #14

                    @zeldman oh I just make sure to include typeos so you know it's not made by the overused spellchecker sometimes called an LLM.

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                    • zeldman@front-end.socialZ zeldman@front-end.social

                      Abandon the em-dash in your human writing?

                      The irony—and it’s a big irony—is that real writers use em-dash frequently, and for reasons. As a written signifier of verbal speech pauses, it means something different than what commas and semicolons mean. It connects while separating.

                      That’s why so many writers use em-dash when it is the best mark for the job. And chatbots use it because they were schooled on millions of writers.

                      1/3

                      jadedtwin@corteximplant.comJ This user is from outside of this forum
                      jadedtwin@corteximplant.comJ This user is from outside of this forum
                      jadedtwin@corteximplant.com
                      wrote last edited by
                      #15

                      @zeldman the em-dash argument is goofy nonsense and literally "abandon brushes because slop generators make fake paintings". A Logic 101 class at your local community college is enough to poke holes in the "em-dashes are tainted by bots" argument.

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                      • suethepooh@mastodon.socialS suethepooh@mastodon.social

                        @zeldman i learned american punctuation in school. then i worked on an online training platform and was instructed to change the content to uk punctuation. now i don't know what i'm doing.

                        michellebacon@mstdn.socialM This user is from outside of this forum
                        michellebacon@mstdn.socialM This user is from outside of this forum
                        michellebacon@mstdn.social
                        wrote last edited by
                        #16

                        @suethepooh @zeldman This is like being Canadian. When installing software we must choose between English (U.S.) and English (UK). With a grimace of resentment, I choose U.S. And gradually forget how to spell correctly.

                        1 Reply Last reply
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                        • zeldman@front-end.socialZ zeldman@front-end.social

                          Abandon the em-dash in your human writing?

                          The irony—and it’s a big irony—is that real writers use em-dash frequently, and for reasons. As a written signifier of verbal speech pauses, it means something different than what commas and semicolons mean. It connects while separating.

                          That’s why so many writers use em-dash when it is the best mark for the job. And chatbots use it because they were schooled on millions of writers.

                          1/3

                          vwestlife@mastodon.socialV This user is from outside of this forum
                          vwestlife@mastodon.socialV This user is from outside of this forum
                          vwestlife@mastodon.social
                          wrote last edited by
                          #17

                          @zeldman I just type it the old-fashioned way -- and I don't use curly quotes, either.

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