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  3. This whole "OpenClaw" thing has made me very angry and I wrote a bit about the why.

This whole "OpenClaw" thing has made me very angry and I wrote a bit about the why.

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  • tante@tldr.nettime.orgT tante@tldr.nettime.org

    @Nfoonf they do. There's many OpenClaw meetups where they show each other what their LLMs generated.

    nfoonf@chaos.socialN This user is from outside of this forum
    nfoonf@chaos.socialN This user is from outside of this forum
    nfoonf@chaos.social
    wrote last edited by
    #10

    @tante its like watching a bunch of 4 years olds competeing who can paint the most pictures with ctheir crayons. Only kids actually learn a lot from this.

    tante@tldr.nettime.orgT 1 Reply Last reply
    0
    • nfoonf@chaos.socialN nfoonf@chaos.social

      @tante its like watching a bunch of 4 years olds competeing who can paint the most pictures with ctheir crayons. Only kids actually learn a lot from this.

      tante@tldr.nettime.orgT This user is from outside of this forum
      tante@tldr.nettime.orgT This user is from outside of this forum
      tante@tldr.nettime.org
      wrote last edited by
      #11

      @Nfoonf it's the future.

      nfoonf@chaos.socialN 1 Reply Last reply
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      • tante@tldr.nettime.orgT tante@tldr.nettime.org

        @Nfoonf it's the future.

        nfoonf@chaos.socialN This user is from outside of this forum
        nfoonf@chaos.socialN This user is from outside of this forum
        nfoonf@chaos.social
        wrote last edited by
        #12

        @tante the future is a merge conflict then, i suppose

        1 Reply Last reply
        0
        • tante@tldr.nettime.orgT tante@tldr.nettime.org

          This whole "OpenClaw" thing has made me very angry and I wrote a bit about the why. It's not that "it's AI": It is the way that kind of project invalidates decades of work and care in free software. "AI" software isn't just careless, it is actively rejecting responsibility and care.

          Link Preview Image
          Diffusion of Responsibility

          One of the features of “AI” is the diffusion of responsibility: “AI” systems are being put in all kinds of processes and when they fuck up (and they always fuck up) it was just the “AI”, or “someone should have checked things”. “AI” companies want to sell machines to solve every issue but give no […]

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          Smashing Frames (tante.cc)

          verymetalsite@mastodon.socialV This user is from outside of this forum
          verymetalsite@mastodon.socialV This user is from outside of this forum
          verymetalsite@mastodon.social
          wrote last edited by
          #13

          @tante

          "That’s where human in the loop setups come into play: What if the company can just hire one sucker to “check” all the “AI” slop and when things fall apart that one person has to take the blame. Fun!"

          1 Reply Last reply
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          • tante@tldr.nettime.orgT tante@tldr.nettime.org

            This whole "OpenClaw" thing has made me very angry and I wrote a bit about the why. It's not that "it's AI": It is the way that kind of project invalidates decades of work and care in free software. "AI" software isn't just careless, it is actively rejecting responsibility and care.

            Link Preview Image
            Diffusion of Responsibility

            One of the features of “AI” is the diffusion of responsibility: “AI” systems are being put in all kinds of processes and when they fuck up (and they always fuck up) it was just the “AI”, or “someone should have checked things”. “AI” companies want to sell machines to solve every issue but give no […]

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            madcoder@infosec.exchangeM This user is from outside of this forum
            madcoder@infosec.exchangeM This user is from outside of this forum
            madcoder@infosec.exchange
            wrote last edited by
            #14

            @tante @joe I mean we were just getting rid of memory unsafety — kinda — and we invented a better idiot.

            fluidlogic@oldbytes.spaceF 1 Reply Last reply
            0
            • tante@tldr.nettime.orgT tante@tldr.nettime.org

              This whole "OpenClaw" thing has made me very angry and I wrote a bit about the why. It's not that "it's AI": It is the way that kind of project invalidates decades of work and care in free software. "AI" software isn't just careless, it is actively rejecting responsibility and care.

              Link Preview Image
              Diffusion of Responsibility

              One of the features of “AI” is the diffusion of responsibility: “AI” systems are being put in all kinds of processes and when they fuck up (and they always fuck up) it was just the “AI”, or “someone should have checked things”. “AI” companies want to sell machines to solve every issue but give no […]

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              Smashing Frames (tante.cc)

              J This user is from outside of this forum
              J This user is from outside of this forum
              jameswidman@mastodon.social
              wrote last edited by
              #15

              @tante
              > (Sidenote: It should be the law that when you offer or run an “AI” you are 100% liable for everything it does. Sure, that would kill the whole industry but who gives a shit?)

              i give a shit. i want us, collectively, to deliberately end the entire gen-"a.i." industry. i want the data centers that were built for that purpose to be completely physically dismantled, and the CPUs & DRAM repurposed. i want charges to be brought against its leaders for a wide variety of damages.

              J 1 Reply Last reply
              0
              • J jameswidman@mastodon.social

                @tante
                > (Sidenote: It should be the law that when you offer or run an “AI” you are 100% liable for everything it does. Sure, that would kill the whole industry but who gives a shit?)

                i give a shit. i want us, collectively, to deliberately end the entire gen-"a.i." industry. i want the data centers that were built for that purpose to be completely physically dismantled, and the CPUs & DRAM repurposed. i want charges to be brought against its leaders for a wide variety of damages.

                J This user is from outside of this forum
                J This user is from outside of this forum
                jameswidman@mastodon.social
                wrote last edited by
                #16

                @tante https://mastodon.social/@JamesWidman/116032953161658413

                J dzwiedziu@mastodon.socialD 2 Replies Last reply
                0
                • tante@tldr.nettime.orgT tante@tldr.nettime.org

                  This whole "OpenClaw" thing has made me very angry and I wrote a bit about the why. It's not that "it's AI": It is the way that kind of project invalidates decades of work and care in free software. "AI" software isn't just careless, it is actively rejecting responsibility and care.

                  Link Preview Image
                  Diffusion of Responsibility

                  One of the features of “AI” is the diffusion of responsibility: “AI” systems are being put in all kinds of processes and when they fuck up (and they always fuck up) it was just the “AI”, or “someone should have checked things”. “AI” companies want to sell machines to solve every issue but give no […]

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                  searingtruth@infosec.exchangeS This user is from outside of this forum
                  searingtruth@infosec.exchangeS This user is from outside of this forum
                  searingtruth@infosec.exchange
                  wrote last edited by
                  #17

                  @tante

                  "There is zero artificial intelligence today. There could have been, but 50 years ago the decision was made by most scientists and companies to go with machine learning, which was quick and easy, instead of the difficult task of actually reverse engineering and then replicating the human brain.

                  So instead what we have today is machine learning combined with mass plagiarism which we call ‘generative AI’, essentially performing what is akin to a magic trick so that it appears, at times, to be intelligent.

                  While the topic of machine learning is complex in detail, it is simple in concept, which is all we have room for here. Essentially machine learning is simply presenting many thousands or millions of samples to a computer until the associative components ‘learn’ what it is, for example pictures of a daisy from all angles and incarnations.

                  Then companies scoured the internet in the greatest crime of mass plagiarism in history, and used the basic ability of machine learning to recognize nouns, verbs, etc. to chop up and recombine actual human writings and thoughts into ‘generative AI’.

                  So by recognizing basic grammar and hopefully deducing the basic ideas of a query, and then recombining human writings which appear to match that query, we get a very faulty appearance of intelligence - generative AI.

                  But the problem is, as I said in the beginning, there is no actual intelligence involved at all. These programs have no idea what a daisy, or love, or hate, or compassion, or a truck, or horse, or wagon, or anything else, actually is. They just have the ability to do a very faulty combinatorial trick to appear as if they do.

                  And while the human brain consumes around 20 watts, these massive pattern matching computers consume ever increasing billions.

                  However there is hope that actual general intelligence can be created because, thankfully, a handful of scientists rejected machine learning and instead have been working on recreating the connectome of the human brain for 50 years, and they are within a few decades of achieving that goal and truly replicating the human brain, creating true general intelligence.

                  In the meantime it's important for our species to recognize the danger of relying on generative AI for anything, as it's akin to relying on a magician to conjure up a real, physical, living, bunny rabbit.

                  So relying on it to drive cars, or control any critical systems, will always result in massive errors, often leading to real destruction and death."
                  SearingTruth

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                  • J jameswidman@mastodon.social

                    @tante https://mastodon.social/@JamesWidman/116032953161658413

                    J This user is from outside of this forum
                    J This user is from outside of this forum
                    jameswidman@mastodon.social
                    wrote last edited by
                    #18

                    @tante but yeah, the fact the people aren't going to be able to trust FLOSS for the foreseeable future is... unimaginably bad.

                    it's like if scam health-food influencers took control of the CDC.

                    1 Reply Last reply
                    0
                    • tante@tldr.nettime.orgT tante@tldr.nettime.org

                      This whole "OpenClaw" thing has made me very angry and I wrote a bit about the why. It's not that "it's AI": It is the way that kind of project invalidates decades of work and care in free software. "AI" software isn't just careless, it is actively rejecting responsibility and care.

                      Link Preview Image
                      Diffusion of Responsibility

                      One of the features of “AI” is the diffusion of responsibility: “AI” systems are being put in all kinds of processes and when they fuck up (and they always fuck up) it was just the “AI”, or “someone should have checked things”. “AI” companies want to sell machines to solve every issue but give no […]

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                      Smashing Frames (tante.cc)

                      bens@mastodon.xyzB This user is from outside of this forum
                      bens@mastodon.xyzB This user is from outside of this forum
                      bens@mastodon.xyz
                      wrote last edited by
                      #19

                      @tante @huwr there are a lot of good points and criticisms here, but Peter is not the “tech bro wannabe Elon” you say he is. He’s actually a caring thoughtful human who will probably be really hurt by these words.

                      1 Reply Last reply
                      0
                      • tante@tldr.nettime.orgT tante@tldr.nettime.org

                        @mttaggart @stefan_hessbrueggen thank you so much!

                        rotnroll666@mastodon.socialR This user is from outside of this forum
                        rotnroll666@mastodon.socialR This user is from outside of this forum
                        rotnroll666@mastodon.social
                        wrote last edited by
                        #20

                        @tante @mttaggart @stefan_hessbrueggen here’s the blog from Scott https://theshamblog.com/an-ai-agent-published-a-hit-piece-on-me/ mind blowing.

                        cgudrian@social.tchncs.deC 1 Reply Last reply
                        0
                        • rotnroll666@mastodon.socialR rotnroll666@mastodon.social

                          @tante @mttaggart @stefan_hessbrueggen here’s the blog from Scott https://theshamblog.com/an-ai-agent-published-a-hit-piece-on-me/ mind blowing.

                          cgudrian@social.tchncs.deC This user is from outside of this forum
                          cgudrian@social.tchncs.deC This user is from outside of this forum
                          cgudrian@social.tchncs.de
                          wrote last edited by
                          #21

                          @rotnroll666 The Kessler syndrome of the Internet.

                          @tante @mttaggart

                          1 Reply Last reply
                          0
                          • tante@tldr.nettime.orgT tante@tldr.nettime.org

                            This whole "OpenClaw" thing has made me very angry and I wrote a bit about the why. It's not that "it's AI": It is the way that kind of project invalidates decades of work and care in free software. "AI" software isn't just careless, it is actively rejecting responsibility and care.

                            Link Preview Image
                            Diffusion of Responsibility

                            One of the features of “AI” is the diffusion of responsibility: “AI” systems are being put in all kinds of processes and when they fuck up (and they always fuck up) it was just the “AI”, or “someone should have checked things”. “AI” companies want to sell machines to solve every issue but give no […]

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                            demiguise@linuxrocks.onlineD This user is from outside of this forum
                            demiguise@linuxrocks.onlineD This user is from outside of this forum
                            demiguise@linuxrocks.online
                            wrote last edited by
                            #22

                            @tante "but at least as secure as commercial offerings now slowing going down the drain."

                            Shouldn't it be "slowly going down"?

                            tante@tldr.nettime.orgT 1 Reply Last reply
                            0
                            • tante@tldr.nettime.orgT tante@tldr.nettime.org

                              This whole "OpenClaw" thing has made me very angry and I wrote a bit about the why. It's not that "it's AI": It is the way that kind of project invalidates decades of work and care in free software. "AI" software isn't just careless, it is actively rejecting responsibility and care.

                              Link Preview Image
                              Diffusion of Responsibility

                              One of the features of “AI” is the diffusion of responsibility: “AI” systems are being put in all kinds of processes and when they fuck up (and they always fuck up) it was just the “AI”, or “someone should have checked things”. “AI” companies want to sell machines to solve every issue but give no […]

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                              agowa338@chaos.socialA This user is from outside of this forum
                              agowa338@chaos.socialA This user is from outside of this forum
                              agowa338@chaos.social
                              wrote last edited by
                              #23

                              @tante
                              Someone called vibe coded software the "fast fashion of software development" and that is kinda a good summary to get the point across to people unfamiliar with the FOSS ecosystem.

                              What do you think?

                              tante@tldr.nettime.orgT davidgerard@circumstances.runD 2 Replies Last reply
                              0
                              • agowa338@chaos.socialA agowa338@chaos.social

                                @tante
                                Someone called vibe coded software the "fast fashion of software development" and that is kinda a good summary to get the point across to people unfamiliar with the FOSS ecosystem.

                                What do you think?

                                tante@tldr.nettime.orgT This user is from outside of this forum
                                tante@tldr.nettime.orgT This user is from outside of this forum
                                tante@tldr.nettime.org
                                wrote last edited by
                                #24

                                @agowa338 that might actually have been me 😉
                                https://tante.cc/2026/01/15/software-as-fast-fashion/

                                agowa338@chaos.socialA 1 Reply Last reply
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                                • J jameswidman@mastodon.social

                                  @tante https://mastodon.social/@JamesWidman/116032953161658413

                                  dzwiedziu@mastodon.socialD This user is from outside of this forum
                                  dzwiedziu@mastodon.socialD This user is from outside of this forum
                                  dzwiedziu@mastodon.social
                                  wrote last edited by
                                  #25

                                  @JamesWidman
                                  We need to read Dune's works about the Butlerian Jihad.

                                  @tante

                                  1 Reply Last reply
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                                  • tante@tldr.nettime.orgT tante@tldr.nettime.org

                                    @agowa338 that might actually have been me 😉
                                    https://tante.cc/2026/01/15/software-as-fast-fashion/

                                    agowa338@chaos.socialA This user is from outside of this forum
                                    agowa338@chaos.socialA This user is from outside of this forum
                                    agowa338@chaos.social
                                    wrote last edited by
                                    #26

                                    @tante
                                    Oh, ok kinda liked that summary a bit more 🙂

                                    Also regarding rejection of responsibility and care, I wonder how much longer that'll still be possible.
                                    Esp. when things like the person asking in the company chat about the fire alarm being real got told by the chatbot it wasn't and that she doesn't have to leave get more widespread. Did you see that one?

                                    Link Preview Image
                                    Tagir Valeev (@tagir_valeev@mastodon.online)

                                    Attached: 2 images Today we had a fire alarm in the office. A colleague wrote to a Slack channel 'Fire alarm in the office building', to start a thread if somebody knows any details. We have AI assistant Glean integrated into the Slack, and it answered privately to her: "today's siren is just a scheduled test and you do not need to leave your workplace". It was not a test or a drill, it was a real fire alarm. Someday, AI will kill us.

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                                    dec23k@mastodon.ieD 1 Reply Last reply
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                                    • tante@tldr.nettime.orgT tante@tldr.nettime.org

                                      This whole "OpenClaw" thing has made me very angry and I wrote a bit about the why. It's not that "it's AI": It is the way that kind of project invalidates decades of work and care in free software. "AI" software isn't just careless, it is actively rejecting responsibility and care.

                                      Link Preview Image
                                      Diffusion of Responsibility

                                      One of the features of “AI” is the diffusion of responsibility: “AI” systems are being put in all kinds of processes and when they fuck up (and they always fuck up) it was just the “AI”, or “someone should have checked things”. “AI” companies want to sell machines to solve every issue but give no […]

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                                      rakoo@blah.rako.spaceR This user is from outside of this forum
                                      rakoo@blah.rako.spaceR This user is from outside of this forum
                                      rakoo@blah.rako.space
                                      wrote last edited by
                                      #27
                                      The sad thing is that "open-source" has always been that: a libertarian "do what you want I'm not responsible" ecosystem. Libre software at least tried to make it so that you must make it a collective thing, but still with very little needed coordination. Not surprising seeing where those 2, and computing in general comes from (white rich cishet men who never had any real issues in their life)

                                      What we need is to uproot this foundation. Start from a collective mindset, build from communities where we all listen and take care of each other. Taken to the extreme open licenses are useless: it is better to have a closed-source system that your community controls (ie the community has full control over what the thing does, but outsider don't necessarily) than an open-source system that everyone must understand on their own, leading to in practice control only by those who build it.
                                      1 Reply Last reply
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                                      • tante@tldr.nettime.orgT tante@tldr.nettime.org

                                        This whole "OpenClaw" thing has made me very angry and I wrote a bit about the why. It's not that "it's AI": It is the way that kind of project invalidates decades of work and care in free software. "AI" software isn't just careless, it is actively rejecting responsibility and care.

                                        Link Preview Image
                                        Diffusion of Responsibility

                                        One of the features of “AI” is the diffusion of responsibility: “AI” systems are being put in all kinds of processes and when they fuck up (and they always fuck up) it was just the “AI”, or “someone should have checked things”. “AI” companies want to sell machines to solve every issue but give no […]

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                                        P This user is from outside of this forum
                                        P This user is from outside of this forum
                                        piyuv@techhub.social
                                        wrote last edited by
                                        #28

                                        @tante very well said. His thirst for nazi-bar fame is apparent.

                                        You didn’t even touch on the uselessness of the project: none of these incel-adjacent techbros need a (digital or not) assistant in their lives; they just want to feel important. Message “something” in their WhatsApp/telegram (not irc, jabber or matrix) instead of just opening their calendar app

                                        1 Reply Last reply
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                                        • tante@tldr.nettime.orgT tante@tldr.nettime.org

                                          This whole "OpenClaw" thing has made me very angry and I wrote a bit about the why. It's not that "it's AI": It is the way that kind of project invalidates decades of work and care in free software. "AI" software isn't just careless, it is actively rejecting responsibility and care.

                                          Link Preview Image
                                          Diffusion of Responsibility

                                          One of the features of “AI” is the diffusion of responsibility: “AI” systems are being put in all kinds of processes and when they fuck up (and they always fuck up) it was just the “AI”, or “someone should have checked things”. “AI” companies want to sell machines to solve every issue but give no […]

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                                          derunglaublichefalk@chaos.socialD This user is from outside of this forum
                                          derunglaublichefalk@chaos.socialD This user is from outside of this forum
                                          derunglaublichefalk@chaos.social
                                          wrote last edited by
                                          #29

                                          @tante "handing out running chainsaws to kids" that's exactly their way of responsibility.

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