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CIRCLE WITH A DOT

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  3. It's #WorldBicycleDay and a good time to mention this graph from Scientific American, first published in 1973, and updated 2025.

It's #WorldBicycleDay and a good time to mention this graph from Scientific American, first published in 1973, and updated 2025.

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worldbicycledaybiketooterclimate
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  • two9a@hachyderm.ioT This user is from outside of this forum
    two9a@hachyderm.ioT This user is from outside of this forum
    two9a@hachyderm.io
    wrote last edited by
    #1

    It's #WorldBicycleDay and a good time to mention this graph from Scientific American, first published in 1973, and updated 2025.

    A person on a bike is the world's most energy-efficient mode of transport, and it's not even close. Salmon use three times as many joules/g/km to get around, and then it's jet aircraft at 5x.

    #BikeTooter #Climate

    kingmaype@mastodon.greenK androcat@toot.catA dcz@fosstodon.orgD publicwondering@mastodon.me.ukP two9a@hachyderm.ioT 18 Replies Last reply
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    • two9a@hachyderm.ioT two9a@hachyderm.io

      It's #WorldBicycleDay and a good time to mention this graph from Scientific American, first published in 1973, and updated 2025.

      A person on a bike is the world's most energy-efficient mode of transport, and it's not even close. Salmon use three times as many joules/g/km to get around, and then it's jet aircraft at 5x.

      #BikeTooter #Climate

      kingmaype@mastodon.greenK This user is from outside of this forum
      kingmaype@mastodon.greenK This user is from outside of this forum
      kingmaype@mastodon.green
      wrote last edited by
      #2

      @Two9A

      And still missing the human on a fully electric bicycle, who would be at least 3 times more efficient than on a normale bicycle.

      lovestha@floss.socialL markhburton@mstdn.socialM 2 Replies Last reply
      0
      • kingmaype@mastodon.greenK kingmaype@mastodon.green

        @Two9A

        And still missing the human on a fully electric bicycle, who would be at least 3 times more efficient than on a normale bicycle.

        lovestha@floss.socialL This user is from outside of this forum
        lovestha@floss.socialL This user is from outside of this forum
        lovestha@floss.social
        wrote last edited by
        #3

        @KingmaYpe @Two9A Trains and buses missing is also interesting choices.

        two9a@hachyderm.ioT markhburton@mstdn.socialM 2 Replies Last reply
        0
        • lovestha@floss.socialL lovestha@floss.social

          @KingmaYpe @Two9A Trains and buses missing is also interesting choices.

          two9a@hachyderm.ioT This user is from outside of this forum
          two9a@hachyderm.ioT This user is from outside of this forum
          two9a@hachyderm.io
          wrote last edited by
          #4

          @LovesTha @KingmaYpe At least the ebike missing makes sense, if the data's from 1973; the energy efficiency of the average train or bus you'd need to ask SciAm for, as to where it sits on this plot.

          I'd _guess_ they'd sit on the far lower right, at the bottom of that vehicular zone, which would still make "human on bike" lower on energy use.

          lovestha@floss.socialL kingmaype@mastodon.greenK 2 Replies Last reply
          0
          • two9a@hachyderm.ioT two9a@hachyderm.io

            It's #WorldBicycleDay and a good time to mention this graph from Scientific American, first published in 1973, and updated 2025.

            A person on a bike is the world's most energy-efficient mode of transport, and it's not even close. Salmon use three times as many joules/g/km to get around, and then it's jet aircraft at 5x.

            #BikeTooter #Climate

            androcat@toot.catA This user is from outside of this forum
            androcat@toot.catA This user is from outside of this forum
            androcat@toot.cat
            wrote last edited by
            #5

            @Two9A The chart implies that there are huge-ass fish almost as efficient as human-on-a-bicycle

            Apparently, the old adage is wrong:
            Some fish might not need bicycles, but other fish might.

            1 Reply Last reply
            0
            • two9a@hachyderm.ioT two9a@hachyderm.io

              It's #WorldBicycleDay and a good time to mention this graph from Scientific American, first published in 1973, and updated 2025.

              A person on a bike is the world's most energy-efficient mode of transport, and it's not even close. Salmon use three times as many joules/g/km to get around, and then it's jet aircraft at 5x.

              #BikeTooter #Climate

              dcz@fosstodon.orgD This user is from outside of this forum
              dcz@fosstodon.orgD This user is from outside of this forum
              dcz@fosstodon.org
              wrote last edited by
              #6

              @Two9A Having had to carry a velomobile down some steps recently, I ask: where did the chart makers get their data from?

              two9a@hachyderm.ioT 1 Reply Last reply
              0
              • R relay@relay.publicsquare.global shared this topic
              • dcz@fosstodon.orgD dcz@fosstodon.org

                @Two9A Having had to carry a velomobile down some steps recently, I ask: where did the chart makers get their data from?

                two9a@hachyderm.ioT This user is from outside of this forum
                two9a@hachyderm.ioT This user is from outside of this forum
                two9a@hachyderm.io
                wrote last edited by
                #7

                @dcz Especially being that "velomobile" is slightly lower in weight than "bicycle" leads me to the measurement being of exactly one data point, and that person being relatively lithe.

                1 Reply Last reply
                0
                • two9a@hachyderm.ioT two9a@hachyderm.io

                  It's #WorldBicycleDay and a good time to mention this graph from Scientific American, first published in 1973, and updated 2025.

                  A person on a bike is the world's most energy-efficient mode of transport, and it's not even close. Salmon use three times as many joules/g/km to get around, and then it's jet aircraft at 5x.

                  #BikeTooter #Climate

                  publicwondering@mastodon.me.ukP This user is from outside of this forum
                  publicwondering@mastodon.me.ukP This user is from outside of this forum
                  publicwondering@mastodon.me.uk
                  wrote last edited by
                  #8

                  @Two9A missing from graph: horse on bicycle. I'm assuming it would be epic.

                  1 Reply Last reply
                  0
                  • two9a@hachyderm.ioT two9a@hachyderm.io

                    It's #WorldBicycleDay and a good time to mention this graph from Scientific American, first published in 1973, and updated 2025.

                    A person on a bike is the world's most energy-efficient mode of transport, and it's not even close. Salmon use three times as many joules/g/km to get around, and then it's jet aircraft at 5x.

                    #BikeTooter #Climate

                    two9a@hachyderm.ioT This user is from outside of this forum
                    two9a@hachyderm.ioT This user is from outside of this forum
                    two9a@hachyderm.io
                    wrote last edited by
                    #9

                    One side-effect of using a phone keyboard from the 19th century that doesn't auto-correct: typos everywhere in the alt-text. I'll leave them in as a sign of authenticity, I guess.

                    1 Reply Last reply
                    0
                    • kingmaype@mastodon.greenK kingmaype@mastodon.green

                      @Two9A

                      And still missing the human on a fully electric bicycle, who would be at least 3 times more efficient than on a normale bicycle.

                      markhburton@mstdn.socialM This user is from outside of this forum
                      markhburton@mstdn.socialM This user is from outside of this forum
                      markhburton@mstdn.social
                      wrote last edited by
                      #10

                      @KingmaYpe @Two9A
                      How can that possibly be true?

                      two9a@hachyderm.ioT 1 Reply Last reply
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                      • two9a@hachyderm.ioT two9a@hachyderm.io

                        @LovesTha @KingmaYpe At least the ebike missing makes sense, if the data's from 1973; the energy efficiency of the average train or bus you'd need to ask SciAm for, as to where it sits on this plot.

                        I'd _guess_ they'd sit on the far lower right, at the bottom of that vehicular zone, which would still make "human on bike" lower on energy use.

                        lovestha@floss.socialL This user is from outside of this forum
                        lovestha@floss.socialL This user is from outside of this forum
                        lovestha@floss.social
                        wrote last edited by
                        #11

                        @Two9A @KingmaYpe the cloud of machine points implies they used such data, they just didn't choose to highlight the bus and train.

                        lovestha@floss.socialL 1 Reply Last reply
                        0
                        • two9a@hachyderm.ioT two9a@hachyderm.io

                          @LovesTha @KingmaYpe At least the ebike missing makes sense, if the data's from 1973; the energy efficiency of the average train or bus you'd need to ask SciAm for, as to where it sits on this plot.

                          I'd _guess_ they'd sit on the far lower right, at the bottom of that vehicular zone, which would still make "human on bike" lower on energy use.

                          kingmaype@mastodon.greenK This user is from outside of this forum
                          kingmaype@mastodon.greenK This user is from outside of this forum
                          kingmaype@mastodon.green
                          wrote last edited by
                          #12

                          @Two9A @LovesTha

                          They updated in 2025, maybe at the next update they will be interested in maximum efficiency.

                          1 Reply Last reply
                          0
                          • lovestha@floss.socialL lovestha@floss.social

                            @KingmaYpe @Two9A Trains and buses missing is also interesting choices.

                            markhburton@mstdn.socialM This user is from outside of this forum
                            markhburton@mstdn.socialM This user is from outside of this forum
                            markhburton@mstdn.social
                            wrote last edited by
                            #13

                            @LovesTha @KingmaYpe @Two9A
                            No trains either!

                            1 Reply Last reply
                            0
                            • markhburton@mstdn.socialM markhburton@mstdn.social

                              @KingmaYpe @Two9A
                              How can that possibly be true?

                              two9a@hachyderm.ioT This user is from outside of this forum
                              two9a@hachyderm.ioT This user is from outside of this forum
                              two9a@hachyderm.io
                              wrote last edited by
                              #14

                              @markhburton @KingmaYpe Mm, it may feel like it's three times more efficient for the human pedalling, but that load's been transferred to the motor I guess.

                              Definitely on a par for efficiency though.

                              kingmaype@mastodon.greenK markhburton@mstdn.socialM 2 Replies Last reply
                              0
                              • lovestha@floss.socialL lovestha@floss.social

                                @Two9A @KingmaYpe the cloud of machine points implies they used such data, they just didn't choose to highlight the bus and train.

                                lovestha@floss.socialL This user is from outside of this forum
                                lovestha@floss.socialL This user is from outside of this forum
                                lovestha@floss.social
                                wrote last edited by
                                #15

                                @Two9A @KingmaYpe the first piece of data I can find converts to 0.3 calories per gram per km for freight trains. So probably as efficient as human in velomobile.

                                Edit: sorry, reading chart badly. 0.3 is worse than the bikes. But still very good

                                lovestha@floss.socialL 1 Reply Last reply
                                0
                                • lovestha@floss.socialL lovestha@floss.social

                                  @Two9A @KingmaYpe the first piece of data I can find converts to 0.3 calories per gram per km for freight trains. So probably as efficient as human in velomobile.

                                  Edit: sorry, reading chart badly. 0.3 is worse than the bikes. But still very good

                                  lovestha@floss.socialL This user is from outside of this forum
                                  lovestha@floss.socialL This user is from outside of this forum
                                  lovestha@floss.social
                                  wrote last edited by
                                  #16

                                  @Two9A @KingmaYpe but I don't think I trust freight train as only twice as energy efficient as a jet.

                                  two9a@hachyderm.ioT 1 Reply Last reply
                                  0
                                  • two9a@hachyderm.ioT two9a@hachyderm.io

                                    @markhburton @KingmaYpe Mm, it may feel like it's three times more efficient for the human pedalling, but that load's been transferred to the motor I guess.

                                    Definitely on a par for efficiency though.

                                    kingmaype@mastodon.greenK This user is from outside of this forum
                                    kingmaype@mastodon.greenK This user is from outside of this forum
                                    kingmaype@mastodon.green
                                    wrote last edited by
                                    #17

                                    @Two9A @markhburton

                                    Muscles are about as efficient as combustion engines.

                                    kingmaype@mastodon.greenK 1 Reply Last reply
                                    0
                                    • two9a@hachyderm.ioT two9a@hachyderm.io

                                      It's #WorldBicycleDay and a good time to mention this graph from Scientific American, first published in 1973, and updated 2025.

                                      A person on a bike is the world's most energy-efficient mode of transport, and it's not even close. Salmon use three times as many joules/g/km to get around, and then it's jet aircraft at 5x.

                                      #BikeTooter #Climate

                                      W This user is from outside of this forum
                                      W This user is from outside of this forum
                                      woo@fosstodon.org
                                      wrote last edited by
                                      #18

                                      @Two9A When you look at how close to zero it is, it's amazing how much people will spend for a tiny increase in efficiency.

                                      The first person I knew who bought an expensive bike realised that the lock he bought to protect it weighed more than the weight he'd saved by buying expensive tubing.

                                      W 1 Reply Last reply
                                      0
                                      • two9a@hachyderm.ioT two9a@hachyderm.io

                                        @markhburton @KingmaYpe Mm, it may feel like it's three times more efficient for the human pedalling, but that load's been transferred to the motor I guess.

                                        Definitely on a par for efficiency though.

                                        markhburton@mstdn.socialM This user is from outside of this forum
                                        markhburton@mstdn.socialM This user is from outside of this forum
                                        markhburton@mstdn.social
                                        wrote last edited by
                                        #19

                                        @Two9A @KingmaYpe
                                        You'd have to include at least the energy used in generation, transmission and battery losses, and conversion losses motion to electricity at source, and vice versa at the motor.
                                        That's not taking account of the additional mining, processing, manufacture and distribution of the motor battery, and charger.

                                        1 Reply Last reply
                                        0
                                        • lovestha@floss.socialL lovestha@floss.social

                                          @Two9A @KingmaYpe but I don't think I trust freight train as only twice as energy efficient as a jet.

                                          two9a@hachyderm.ioT This user is from outside of this forum
                                          two9a@hachyderm.ioT This user is from outside of this forum
                                          two9a@hachyderm.io
                                          wrote last edited by
                                          #20

                                          @LovesTha @KingmaYpe I dunno, the widebodies with the gargantuan turbofans are astonishingly efficient. I found figures for the A330neo as operated by Cebu Pacific (with 459 seats crammed into economy) of 250 tons takeoff weight, 1.75L/100km of Jet-A used per seat; that translates to 0.6 cal/g/km if my sums work out.

                                          maccruiskeen@social.linux.pizzaM 1 Reply Last reply
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