You can't put the genie back in the bottle 🤡
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@jenniferplusplus I was thinking about this today. It's like they watched Star Trek or other sci-fi, saw the "black box" devices that relied on a central service to run, and said "I want some of that".
They want us all to have dumb devices we pay them for that use their services, that we pay even more for.
The saddest part is every single company seems to be onboard with this, despite them suffering greatly now because of it
Where it gets interesting I think is to consider the flip side of the coin. So big tech and the corporate world is all-in on AI technologies that serve to further erode social fabric of society, towards dystopic future if they have their way. A risk clearly perceived by many people who have a longing and human needs for real connection and social cohesion.
Big tech AI does not deliver there. It does not address people's needs in these regards.
Another way of formulating is saying that Big Tech is retracting from the 'market of real human connection'. In other words it leaves market space, places for people and small initiatives to most excellently fill these gaps. At the smaller scales, inter-community, across institutions and non-profits, small sustainable businesses, paying real attention to people and their needs instead of placing an artificial entity in front of them that separates them from others, becomes the true unique selling point for a commons.
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So you can see how that genie is extremely prone to returning to it's bottle.
It only stays out as long as they can keep shoveling an ever increasing amount of real resources into it. And it turns out the resources available are finite
@jenniferplusplus I wouldn't compare AI with a genie rather than with Pandora's box because you won't get AI back into anything.
Not that AI is good or bad but too many companies and investors have pumped so much money into AI that it's about time to think of ROI.
AI is no charity even though one of the leading companies has Open in its name.So, imo AI stays as long as the investors don't have their money back and it can take a long time until that happens. And then the earning starts.
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@jenniferplusplus I wouldn't compare AI with a genie rather than with Pandora's box because you won't get AI back into anything.
Not that AI is good or bad but too many companies and investors have pumped so much money into AI that it's about time to think of ROI.
AI is no charity even though one of the leading companies has Open in its name.So, imo AI stays as long as the investors don't have their money back and it can take a long time until that happens. And then the earning starts.
@Brokar @jenniferplusplus surely in 10 years time the investors are not still burning all their money at the current rate because they've run out of money? And we're not building data centres at the current rate because can't power them?
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You can't put the genie back in the bottle
Meanwhile, the genie is only kept out of the bottle by the force of literally the entirety of the world's available investment capital
@jenniferplusplus
"You can't put the genie back in the bottle" - spoiler alert: it wasn't Jeannie anyway, but her evil sister! -
For the record, AI is a technocratic political project for the purpose of industrializing knowledge work.
That industrialization of knowledge work has 2 parts. First, is mechanization. Making knowledge work dependent on some particular machine. This is already the case, with computers generally. Knowledge work is thoroughly computerized. But, those computers are small, cheap, universally available commodities. That doesn't serve the second part, so they're forcing in new layers of mechanization, and removing access to the old machines.
Second, they ensure those machines can only be obtained through large investments of capital. Thus, all knowledge work can be done only at the pleasure of the capitalists who own the machines. Personal computers don't help them, there. But a black box hosted service that consumes the entire web to build and a whole country's worth of electricity to operate sure as hell does.
"AI" is merely the banner under which they are organizing and justifying this project. The implementation details are just the implementation details.
@jenniferplusplus
Thanks for this, it's a very clear explanation. -
@jenniferplusplus
"You can't put the genie back in the bottle" - spoiler alert: it wasn't Jeannie anyway, but her evil sister!@SmartmanApps @jenniferplusplus
It is a funny metaphor, because all it takes to put a genie back in a bottle is three wishes.
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@jenniferplusplus I wonder whether it will actually lead to us getting more analog in the end. Basically reverting to what it’s been like before computers became mainstream. Cause if you piss off your consumer base little too much they can decide to ditch your whole set of artificial limits all together. I see many people doing just that with social media now, we cut heavily on our use, select things like Mastodon instead of the Meta, resorting to books for entertainment etc.
@architektdiewelt @jenniferplusplus
my growing numbers of homeless friends have wire snips and contractor bags full of zebra mussels.oh, and one more thing:
they have nothing left to lose. -
For the record, AI is a technocratic political project for the purpose of industrializing knowledge work.
That industrialization of knowledge work has 2 parts. First, is mechanization. Making knowledge work dependent on some particular machine. This is already the case, with computers generally. Knowledge work is thoroughly computerized. But, those computers are small, cheap, universally available commodities. That doesn't serve the second part, so they're forcing in new layers of mechanization, and removing access to the old machines.
Second, they ensure those machines can only be obtained through large investments of capital. Thus, all knowledge work can be done only at the pleasure of the capitalists who own the machines. Personal computers don't help them, there. But a black box hosted service that consumes the entire web to build and a whole country's worth of electricity to operate sure as hell does.
"AI" is merely the banner under which they are organizing and justifying this project. The implementation details are just the implementation details.
@jenniferplusplus this is such a good description of what I've been thinking too, but couldn't figure out how to put into words
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You can't put the genie back in the bottle
Meanwhile, the genie is only kept out of the bottle by the force of literally the entirety of the world's available investment capital
@jenniferplusplus well said
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R relay@relay.mycrowd.ca shared this topic
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So you can see how that genie is extremely prone to returning to it's bottle.
It only stays out as long as they can keep shoveling an ever increasing amount of real resources into it. And it turns out the resources available are finite
@jenniferplusplus how do small language models that can be run locally or self hosted factor into this? Perhaps they represent tools that can still be controlled locally rather than by large investors.
Counter arguments:
1. They still need to be trained
2. Hardware prices are rising, hardware capable of running even small models may become out of reach -
@jenniferplusplus how do small language models that can be run locally or self hosted factor into this? Perhaps they represent tools that can still be controlled locally rather than by large investors.
Counter arguments:
1. They still need to be trained
2. Hardware prices are rising, hardware capable of running even small models may become out of reach@alter_kaker mostly by recruiting people who should know better to defend the AI project, it seems
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You can't put the genie back in the bottle
Meanwhile, the genie is only kept out of the bottle by the force of literally the entirety of the world's available investment capital
@jenniferplusplus this is one of those statements that sounds hyperbolic but really isn't 🫠
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@jenniferplusplus I wonder whether it will actually lead to us getting more analog in the end. Basically reverting to what it’s been like before computers became mainstream. Cause if you piss off your consumer base little too much they can decide to ditch your whole set of artificial limits all together. I see many people doing just that with social media now, we cut heavily on our use, select things like Mastodon instead of the Meta, resorting to books for entertainment etc.
>> ditch...all together
I hope this will happen, and personally plan for it, too.
Once the total surveillance will come, that is currently masked as "age verification", I think I'll just stop using >95% of the online world. Will I shed some tears ? Maybe yes, but on the other hand it will be so much fun to build local networks again, and to open up new spaces which are not controlled by this unholy government/bigtech melange. Kind of like the 90s.
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@jenniferplusplus this is a brilliant thread, thank you!
@jenniferplusplus @cairobraga Apple has run out of most Mac Studio and Mini models because there are so many people who understand this, and do not wish to be subservient to the cloud any longer. Silver lining: Another crack at a world where every household as a decent server and every neighborhood has a small tech geeks co-op to steward them.
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@alter_kaker mostly by recruiting people who should know better to defend the AI project, it seems
@jenniferplusplus I'm sorry, I don't understand
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@jenniferplusplus I'm sorry, I don't understand
@alter_kaker how do small language models that can be run locally or self hosted factor into this?
They don't change anything at all about the power dynamics. They don't change anything at all about whether you can do or economically benefit from work that capitalists disapprove of. What they do is distract people who are concerned about those facts, and make everyone else spend time explaining to them that they don't actually change the political situation at all.
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You can't put the genie back in the bottle
Meanwhile, the genie is only kept out of the bottle by the force of literally the entirety of the world's available investment capital
@jenniferplusplus you know, that's a good point. I'll remember that next time someone says that to me in "meatspace"
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Obviously, the models are going to continue to exist. Probably. So will the data sets, the libraries, and the generalized knowledge of how to build them and what that gets you, in a technical sense.
And if you think that's what AI is?
@jenniferplusplus This thread is
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@jenniferplusplus @cairobraga Apple has run out of most Mac Studio and Mini models because there are so many people who understand this, and do not wish to be subservient to the cloud any longer. Silver lining: Another crack at a world where every household as a decent server and every neighborhood has a small tech geeks co-op to steward them.
@slowenough @jenniferplusplus @cairobraga I love the idea of neighborhood IT co-ops. Fo any actually exist? Are there resources to help set this sort of thing up?
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@jenniferplusplus Recently called it "a social weapon masquerading as a technology" because of ALL of this and more.
@joshuaelliott @jenniferplusplus The GPT has been weaponized. The noosphere is under assault. The contingency must be handled. The consequences are potentially species ending. AGI and ASI are fantasies here -- the true adversaries are human. The really sad part is that the technology isn't even fit for purpose, but the market fundamentalist vs state capitalist factions are using it to engage in what is a noospheric hot war. The Potemkin effect in mass media: Total Information Warfare.
