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  3. ArXiv announces a ban on AI content and the responses are hilarious.

ArXiv announces a ban on AI content and the responses are hilarious.

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  • adriano@lile.clA adriano@lile.cl

    @docpop @FediThing Well, his point is *slightly* more nuanced in that he's arguing "What if *I* checked the citations I added, but this other guy I co-author with did not on his part of the paper? Why am I responsible?"

    To which I reply "sucks to be you, my guy."

    heptasean@social.tchncs.deH This user is from outside of this forum
    heptasean@social.tchncs.deH This user is from outside of this forum
    heptasean@social.tchncs.de
    wrote last edited by
    #51

    @adriano @docpop @FediThing Depending on what is usual in his academic field, his thoughts are maybe less “How the f is he a professor?!?” outlandish than the Fedi commenters here think.

    For papers with lots of authors and quite strict division of labour for different parts of the paper and different sub-groups of authors, I can very well see that it maybe has not been usual up to now to know every other author and double check their work.

    Still seems net positive to me to reinforce responsibility for things with your name on it.

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    • docpop@mastodon.socialD docpop@mastodon.social

      ArXiv announces a ban on AI content and the responses are hilarious.

      > You expect us to actually read the papers we cite?!

      yes, lol!

      Link Preview Image
      ArXiv to Ban Researchers for a Year if They Submit AI Slop

      The change comes as arXiv and others struggle to manage an influx of AI-generated materials masquerading as rigorous science.

      favicon

      404 Media (www.404media.co)

      C This user is from outside of this forum
      C This user is from outside of this forum
      carl@chaos.social
      wrote last edited by
      #52

      @docpop the responder does not understand Science

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      • marta@corteximplant.comM marta@corteximplant.com

        @docpop to add, broken trust from your colleagues has been a problem before AI too, here's a particularly popular story https://laskowskilab.faculty.ucdavis.edu/2020/01/29/retractions/

        heptasean@social.tchncs.deH This user is from outside of this forum
        heptasean@social.tchncs.deH This user is from outside of this forum
        heptasean@social.tchncs.de
        wrote last edited by
        #53

        @marta Thank you! I'm also a bit disturbed by the comments here seeing Miller as being _completely_ out of line and ridiculing him for the points raised. His point is more reasonable than the “Why is that guy a professor?!?” mob thinks, but in the end still false in my opinion. Yes, even if you work in a field with papers with lots of authors and quite loose cooperations, you are and should be responsible for papers with your name on it. Laskowski investigating the data manipulation and retracting the papers is a good example for taking that responsibility. @docpop

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        • unchartedworlds@scicomm.xyzU unchartedworlds@scicomm.xyz

          @FediThing @docpop

          He said further down in the thread what he thinks citations are for:

          "The citations are there to help readers who want to learn more about a sub topic, quickly locate new papers. They also function as a business suit, signaling that you're a serious person."

          (yikes)

          and various people have replied to that saying no that is not, in fact, what they are for!

          congusbongus@mastodon.gamedev.placeC This user is from outside of this forum
          congusbongus@mastodon.gamedev.placeC This user is from outside of this forum
          congusbongus@mastodon.gamedev.place
          wrote last edited by
          #54

          @unchartedworlds @FediThing @docpop so all those Wikipedia nerds adding [citation needed] tags just want more reading material? TIL wow lmao

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          • docpop@mastodon.socialD docpop@mastodon.social

            ArXiv announces a ban on AI content and the responses are hilarious.

            > You expect us to actually read the papers we cite?!

            yes, lol!

            Link Preview Image
            ArXiv to Ban Researchers for a Year if They Submit AI Slop

            The change comes as arXiv and others struggle to manage an influx of AI-generated materials masquerading as rigorous science.

            favicon

            404 Media (www.404media.co)

            liztai@hachyderm.ioL This user is from outside of this forum
            liztai@hachyderm.ioL This user is from outside of this forum
            liztai@hachyderm.io
            wrote last edited by
            #55

            @docpop dafuq isn't that a basic skill😅

            1 Reply Last reply
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            • docpop@mastodon.socialD docpop@mastodon.social

              ArXiv announces a ban on AI content and the responses are hilarious.

              > You expect us to actually read the papers we cite?!

              yes, lol!

              Link Preview Image
              ArXiv to Ban Researchers for a Year if They Submit AI Slop

              The change comes as arXiv and others struggle to manage an influx of AI-generated materials masquerading as rigorous science.

              favicon

              404 Media (www.404media.co)

              onnob@mastodon.socialO This user is from outside of this forum
              onnob@mastodon.socialO This user is from outside of this forum
              onnob@mastodon.social
              wrote last edited by
              #56

              @docpop jesus, you have to check everything AI writes. Citations or otherwise. And it can be a great help in finding sources, but you have to check everything. By hand. And brain. Yes, all of it.

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              • docpop@mastodon.socialD docpop@mastodon.social

                ArXiv announces a ban on AI content and the responses are hilarious.

                > You expect us to actually read the papers we cite?!

                yes, lol!

                Link Preview Image
                ArXiv to Ban Researchers for a Year if They Submit AI Slop

                The change comes as arXiv and others struggle to manage an influx of AI-generated materials masquerading as rigorous science.

                favicon

                404 Media (www.404media.co)

                zjb@mastodon.socialZ This user is from outside of this forum
                zjb@mastodon.socialZ This user is from outside of this forum
                zjb@mastodon.social
                wrote last edited by
                #57

                哈哈,这个反应也太真实了。学术圈其实很多人都在偷偷用AI写论文,现在arXiv一禁估计要炸锅了。

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                • ftranschel@norden.socialF ftranschel@norden.social

                  @heafnerj @docpop As in "only highschoolers can reasonably be expected to do this"? 🤣

                  (scnr)

                  heafnerj@mstdn.socialH This user is from outside of this forum
                  heafnerj@mstdn.socialH This user is from outside of this forum
                  heafnerj@mstdn.social
                  wrote last edited by
                  #58

                  @ftranschel @docpop Had to look up scnr then it made sense. 😬

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                  • heafnerj@mstdn.socialH This user is from outside of this forum
                    heafnerj@mstdn.socialH This user is from outside of this forum
                    heafnerj@mstdn.social
                    wrote last edited by
                    #59

                    @Darkphoenix @docpop There are sometimes physics errors in physics textbooks too.

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                    • docpop@mastodon.socialD docpop@mastodon.social

                      ArXiv announces a ban on AI content and the responses are hilarious.

                      > You expect us to actually read the papers we cite?!

                      yes, lol!

                      Link Preview Image
                      ArXiv to Ban Researchers for a Year if They Submit AI Slop

                      The change comes as arXiv and others struggle to manage an influx of AI-generated materials masquerading as rigorous science.

                      favicon

                      404 Media (www.404media.co)

                      theorangetheme@en.osm.townT This user is from outside of this forum
                      theorangetheme@en.osm.townT This user is from outside of this forum
                      theorangetheme@en.osm.town
                      wrote last edited by
                      #60

                      @docpop I can't tell if AI made people stupid or if it just made pre-existing stupid people louder and more obnoxious.

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                      • docpop@mastodon.socialD docpop@mastodon.social

                        ArXiv announces a ban on AI content and the responses are hilarious.

                        > You expect us to actually read the papers we cite?!

                        yes, lol!

                        Link Preview Image
                        ArXiv to Ban Researchers for a Year if They Submit AI Slop

                        The change comes as arXiv and others struggle to manage an influx of AI-generated materials masquerading as rigorous science.

                        favicon

                        404 Media (www.404media.co)

                        adipoeserpursch@troet.cafeA This user is from outside of this forum
                        adipoeserpursch@troet.cafeA This user is from outside of this forum
                        adipoeserpursch@troet.cafe
                        wrote last edited by
                        #61

                        @docpop 🤦🏾‍♂

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                        • jamesmarshall@sfba.socialJ jamesmarshall@sfba.social

                          @docpop from his profile, Miller has a PhD from U. Chicago, a JD from Stanford, and is a professor at Smith College. 😕 I think this reflects badly on every one of those-- what is research from these places actually worth, if fake citations are common there?

                          He and his defenders are basically saying "everyone does it, and you're naive to complain." If it's true that everyone does it, that reflects badly on modern academia as a whole.

                          Any academic researchers want to chime in here?

                          cuchaz@gladtech.socialC This user is from outside of this forum
                          cuchaz@gladtech.socialC This user is from outside of this forum
                          cuchaz@gladtech.social
                          wrote last edited by
                          #62

                          @jamesmarshall @docpop no, we don't make up fake citations. But also sadly, not every co-author checks every citation. We rely on trusting our co-authors to not commit academic fraud.

                          I'm very in favor of verifiable academic fraud leading to (impermanent) bans from preprint servers. If your co-authors are committing fraud and you find out by getting banned from a preprint server, that sucks, but it's a great signal to stop trusting that co-author. Nature will heal.

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                          • docpop@mastodon.socialD docpop@mastodon.social

                            ArXiv announces a ban on AI content and the responses are hilarious.

                            > You expect us to actually read the papers we cite?!

                            yes, lol!

                            Link Preview Image
                            ArXiv to Ban Researchers for a Year if They Submit AI Slop

                            The change comes as arXiv and others struggle to manage an influx of AI-generated materials masquerading as rigorous science.

                            favicon

                            404 Media (www.404media.co)

                            gimulnautti@mastodon.greenG This user is from outside of this forum
                            gimulnautti@mastodon.greenG This user is from outside of this forum
                            gimulnautti@mastodon.green
                            wrote last edited by
                            #63

                            @docpop In a civilised age James Miller would go down in history as the fool of the year. Now he’s just a another hustlebro competing other hustlebros trying to get rich off abuse.. Of systems that literally hold our civilisation together.

                            1 Reply Last reply
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                            • docpop@mastodon.socialD docpop@mastodon.social

                              ArXiv announces a ban on AI content and the responses are hilarious.

                              > You expect us to actually read the papers we cite?!

                              yes, lol!

                              Link Preview Image
                              ArXiv to Ban Researchers for a Year if They Submit AI Slop

                              The change comes as arXiv and others struggle to manage an influx of AI-generated materials masquerading as rigorous science.

                              favicon

                              404 Media (www.404media.co)

                              F This user is from outside of this forum
                              F This user is from outside of this forum
                              frutigeraero00@mastodon.social
                              wrote last edited by
                              #64

                              @docpop "So... We have to actually use our brains? 😭"

                              1 Reply Last reply
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                              • damonhd@mastodon.socialD damonhd@mastodon.social

                                @FediThing @unchartedworlds @docpop The bar to be one is maybe not as high as it should be? (That's how I hope to sneak in as one. maybe!)

                                illuminatus@mstdn.socialI This user is from outside of this forum
                                illuminatus@mstdn.socialI This user is from outside of this forum
                                illuminatus@mstdn.social
                                wrote last edited by
                                #65

                                @DamonHD @FediThing @unchartedworlds @docpop There are universities and colleges and then there are "universities" and "colleges". Have you read about "Trump university"?

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                                • docpop@mastodon.socialD docpop@mastodon.social

                                  ArXiv announces a ban on AI content and the responses are hilarious.

                                  > You expect us to actually read the papers we cite?!

                                  yes, lol!

                                  Link Preview Image
                                  ArXiv to Ban Researchers for a Year if They Submit AI Slop

                                  The change comes as arXiv and others struggle to manage an influx of AI-generated materials masquerading as rigorous science.

                                  favicon

                                  404 Media (www.404media.co)

                                  emmecola@fediscience.orgE This user is from outside of this forum
                                  emmecola@fediscience.orgE This user is from outside of this forum
                                  emmecola@fediscience.org
                                  wrote last edited by
                                  #66

                                  @docpop I think people tend to overestimate the percentage of scientists who actually read, in full, the papers they cite. This isn't about AI, it has always been like that! 🤷🏻

                                  Link Preview Image
                                  Read before you cite!

                                  Abstract page for arXiv paper cond-mat/0212043: Read before you cite!

                                  favicon

                                  arXiv.org (arxiv.org)

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                                  • jamesmarshall@sfba.socialJ jamesmarshall@sfba.social

                                    @a_cubed @docpop thanks for your comment, very informative. I assume your academic society publisher is international? I'm wondering if this is a US problem.

                                    a_cubed@mastodon.socialA This user is from outside of this forum
                                    a_cubed@mastodon.socialA This user is from outside of this forum
                                    a_cubed@mastodon.social
                                    wrote last edited by
                                    #67

                                    @jamesmarshall @docpop
                                    The ACM, US-based but international, particularly in terms of authors, and events with refereed proceedings.

                                    1 Reply Last reply
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                                    • a_cubed@mastodon.socialA a_cubed@mastodon.social

                                      @jamesmarshall @docpop
                                      He's wrong. Not everyone does it. He's trying an argumentum ad populum. I'm on the publication ethics committee of a major Comp Sci academic society publisher and we would redact papers with multiple non-existent citations and ban the authors from submitting to our publications for at least a year.
                                      You submit it as your work, you stand byit as valid. Jointly and severally, although we sometimes go easy on student joint authors with faculty (faculty should know better).

                                      a_cubed@mastodon.socialA This user is from outside of this forum
                                      a_cubed@mastodon.socialA This user is from outside of this forum
                                      a_cubed@mastodon.social
                                      wrote last edited by
                                      #68

                                      @jamesmarshall @docpop @a_cubed
                                      That should be retract, not redact.

                                      1 Reply Last reply
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                                      • docpop@mastodon.socialD docpop@mastodon.social

                                        ArXiv announces a ban on AI content and the responses are hilarious.

                                        > You expect us to actually read the papers we cite?!

                                        yes, lol!

                                        Link Preview Image
                                        ArXiv to Ban Researchers for a Year if They Submit AI Slop

                                        The change comes as arXiv and others struggle to manage an influx of AI-generated materials masquerading as rigorous science.

                                        favicon

                                        404 Media (www.404media.co)

                                        svelmoe@hachyderm.ioS This user is from outside of this forum
                                        svelmoe@hachyderm.ioS This user is from outside of this forum
                                        svelmoe@hachyderm.io
                                        wrote last edited by
                                        #69

                                        @docpop That perfectly underlines one of my main concerns; well outside ecological, ethical, brain rot, unemployment .....okay - a single small concern of mine.

                                        People get lazy and stop checking the product of auto-complete and just ship it thus slop feeds slop.

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