Imagine if US voters had picked Kamala Harris.
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@knowprose @benroyce @Enea90 @randahl
> Saying the path not taken would have been better seems moot.
Good Lord no. I mean, this message mostly has worth for Americans, so I don't non-Americans giving it a pass.
But I am an American, and I fucked up in 2000 by not making sure my vote and my activism kept the Republican out of the presidency, and I learned my lesson. I hope others will take something similar from 2024.
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@benroyce @Enea90 @randahl I cannot tell anyone else what to say or do. I hold no moral high ground over anyone... I am imperfick.
I cannot in good conscience yell at people for making what I perceive as mistakes. I cannot tell them what they did wrong when I myself am uncertain.
All I can do is *ask* people to try to do better as I do. Politely, respectfully, factually.
So I do. And I listen.
So I am sorry for injecting myself where that does not seem welcome.
that's your way. it's a perfectly fine way. i respect it
you don't have to respect my way
but i will speak in my defense:
we don't have the time
if someone needs a kick in the ass, i will kick them in the fucking ass
the house is on fire, it's not time for chit chat
nonvoters need to learn to fucking #vote
nobody has the time for the 10,000 years of respectful dialog it would take to motivate some hopeless lumps to understand their inaction only aids #fascism
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@nando161 @knowprose @Enea90 @randahl
well what they do is they spend billions to destroy it. they do very much intend to make voting illegal. you are in fact identifying their very real intention. you can see them proposing laws to make voting more and more difficult right now, until they snuff it out
*because voting does fucking change things*
anyone who didn't vote for harris because "BoTh SiDeS tHe SaMe" is a fucking moron responsible for the shit we are going through right now
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Imagine if US voters had picked Kamala Harris. She would have continued the Ukraine weapons support, she would have kept the strong alliances with Europe, and she would never have killed the Iran nuclear deal.
Together we could have forced Putin out of Ukraine, there would have been no new, wider war in The Middle East, and the NATO alliance would have been stronger than ever. And in that situation, I think our economies would have been considerably stronger too.
Populism derailed all that.
an admirable analysis but flawed
Harris was even more a tool of the israeli lobby and an emboldened Israel would have caused even more havoc and suffering than it is now
and the genocide would have continued at the 100 deaths per day as it started under Biden
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Imagine if US voters had picked Kamala Harris. She would have continued the Ukraine weapons support, she would have kept the strong alliances with Europe, and she would never have killed the Iran nuclear deal.
Together we could have forced Putin out of Ukraine, there would have been no new, wider war in The Middle East, and the NATO alliance would have been stronger than ever. And in that situation, I think our economies would have been considerably stronger too.
Populism derailed all that.
@randahl If Democrats won most of Europe would still be boiling in that kettle. Because megacorps still pay democrats.
While dems are much much better than reps, it's unrealistic to say that voting dems would solve all of our problems.
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Imagine if US voters had picked Kamala Harris. She would have continued the Ukraine weapons support, she would have kept the strong alliances with Europe, and she would never have killed the Iran nuclear deal.
Together we could have forced Putin out of Ukraine, there would have been no new, wider war in The Middle East, and the NATO alliance would have been stronger than ever. And in that situation, I think our economies would have been considerably stronger too.
Populism derailed all that.
@randahl Respectfully, the electoral college picks the president in the United States, not the popular vote (see Bush v Gore).
Harris never did anything as vice president that implied she'd be good at anything except talking in circles.
I'm not political, but I'm familiar with the names.
Wars happen because banks want to lock countries into further debt and/or establish their central bank in the "bad guy" country.
Your politician is just the influencer face of the machine.
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@knowprose @jztusk @Enea90 @randahl
you stepped in it so you will hear our response
if the dog shits in the kitchen, rubbing their noses in it is unproductive, but so is patiently explaining to a dog who does not speak the problem with shitting in the kitchen
at the very least, they learn from your angry frustrated expression when they see you see their shit
that is the language they understand
while endlessly coddling them means they just keep shitting in the kitchen and learn nothing
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Imagine if US voters had picked Kamala Harris. She would have continued the Ukraine weapons support, she would have kept the strong alliances with Europe, and she would never have killed the Iran nuclear deal.
Together we could have forced Putin out of Ukraine, there would have been no new, wider war in The Middle East, and the NATO alliance would have been stronger than ever. And in that situation, I think our economies would have been considerably stronger too.
Populism derailed all that.
@randahl she would have carried on supporting Israel in its genocide though so that was unsupportable. The least bad is too bad when it includes genocidal Zionism.
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Imagine if US voters had picked Kamala Harris. She would have continued the Ukraine weapons support, she would have kept the strong alliances with Europe, and she would never have killed the Iran nuclear deal.
Together we could have forced Putin out of Ukraine, there would have been no new, wider war in The Middle East, and the NATO alliance would have been stronger than ever. And in that situation, I think our economies would have been considerably stronger too.
Populism derailed all that.
@randahl populism is democracy. Kamala lost because she wasn’t popular. Democrats aren’t popular because they support elites, without the mechanism of cognitive dissonance that the Republicans employ. Democrats simply ask us to say This is Fine while the house burns. Republicans sic the plebes on the people who fight the fire starters. True populism is the solution to both of those, and also why we haven’t really seen it.
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@nando161 @knowprose @Enea90 @randahl
must be nice to be so content while we slide to fascism
to see democracy vs fascism and see no difference is certainly one hell of a radioactive expression of profound stupidity or malice
is it that you don't care? or don't know?
or perhaps you prefer fascism, and hide behind high minded expressions of what is still essentially completely moronic bullshit while you cheer on your own doom?
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Imagine if US voters had picked Kamala Harris. She would have continued the Ukraine weapons support, she would have kept the strong alliances with Europe, and she would never have killed the Iran nuclear deal.
Together we could have forced Putin out of Ukraine, there would have been no new, wider war in The Middle East, and the NATO alliance would have been stronger than ever. And in that situation, I think our economies would have been considerably stronger too.
Populism derailed all that.
@randahl probably, she would have supported (or at the least would not have acted against) the shift from fossil fuels. And that is the main reason we have extreme right politicians in power around the world: safeguard oil profits. (Watch the rise of the oil prices the coming days…)
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@knowprose @jztusk @Enea90 @randahl
you stepped in it so you will hear our response
if the dog shits in the kitchen, rubbing their noses in it is unproductive, but so is patiently explaining to a dog who does not speak the problem with shitting in the kitchen
at the very least, they learn from your angry frustrated expression when they see you see their shit
that is the language they understand
while endlessly coddling them means they just keep shitting in the kitchen and learn nothing
@benroyce @jztusk @Enea90 @randahl
Well. You want me, you got me. I asked politely to step out.
*rolls up newspaper*
Are you affecting anyone other than those who agree with you? Just value signaling?
Is that changing any minds?
No.
Is your value signaling alienating to people?
I imagine so.
No one is your dog.
I am not your dog.
You are not mine.
*puts down newspaper and walks away.*
Your move.
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Imagine if US voters had picked Kamala Harris. She would have continued the Ukraine weapons support, she would have kept the strong alliances with Europe, and she would never have killed the Iran nuclear deal.
Together we could have forced Putin out of Ukraine, there would have been no new, wider war in The Middle East, and the NATO alliance would have been stronger than ever. And in that situation, I think our economies would have been considerably stronger too.
Populism derailed all that.
@randahl Yes, but while she might eventually have listened to the public, she wasn't strong against Gaza, which is *SO* much worse than Trump declaring that they should speed up the genocide and definitely worth throwing away our entire democracy to prevent.
Well, that and the fact she might have been just generally competent instead of unleashing unhinged threats against corporations and other countries at random while trying to start WWIII. Who wouldn't want that? We're SO much better off!
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@nando161 @knowprose @Enea90 @randahl
must be nice to be so content while we slide to fascism
to see democracy vs fascism and see no difference is certainly one hell of a radioactive expression of profound stupidity or malice
is it that you don't care? or don't know?
or perhaps you prefer fascism, and hide behind high minded expressions of what is still essentially completely moronic bullshit while you cheer on your own doom?
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@nando161 @benroyce @knowprose @Enea90 @randahl I see you are quoting somebody here. But you live in Australia, so voting is mandatory, right?
Is there a way to opt out of the mandatory voting?
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@nando161 @knowprose @Enea90 @randahl
i wholeheartedly agree
we both understand that "yay! we beat #fascism! it's all over now!" is a fable for morons
yes: fascism is always with us, always was, and always will be
and so:
to maintain society you need to take out the trash every thursday
forever
you don't take out the trash once and then the problem of "trash" disappears
you have to #vote
always
it's simply a maintenance function
anyone who abandons that is guilty of us living in trash
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@randahl she would have carried on supporting Israel in its genocide though so that was unsupportable. The least bad is too bad when it includes genocidal Zionism.
As if Trump doesn't support Israel right now. You forget about the Board of Peace already?
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@kongakong @randahl you missed my point. Completely.
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Imagine if US voters had picked Kamala Harris. She would have continued the Ukraine weapons support, she would have kept the strong alliances with Europe, and she would never have killed the Iran nuclear deal.
Together we could have forced Putin out of Ukraine, there would have been no new, wider war in The Middle East, and the NATO alliance would have been stronger than ever. And in that situation, I think our economies would have been considerably stronger too.
Populism derailed all that.
@randahl "Populism" wtf
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@randahl populism is democracy. Kamala lost because she wasn’t popular. Democrats aren’t popular because they support elites, without the mechanism of cognitive dissonance that the Republicans employ. Democrats simply ask us to say This is Fine while the house burns. Republicans sic the plebes on the people who fight the fire starters. True populism is the solution to both of those, and also why we haven’t really seen it.
@classwario @randahl Think about what you just said. You're saying Democrats were unpopular because they supported things that the right supports. That's bad, yes, but... The "Republican" got the majority votes. Obviously there was a lot more going on then.
They lost because people who actually cared about trying to fix stuff were convinced at a mass scale that they shouldn't vote for her even if democracy would fall.
No matter how you look at it, she would have been better than Trump.
