I'm so disheartened about my job.
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@rl_dane @VeeRat Sort of squinting and thinking about this and what I keep bumping into is something I’m familiar with seeing in patriarchy and in systemic racism, which is the idea that if you provide enough *value* to someone, that they will see you as a person (and then you will be safe.) And that is, of course, an illusion; people who draw lines between People who are people, and people who are things, generally don’t carve out real human-shaped exceptions for anyone who didn’t come prepackaged to them as a capital-P Person, they just find certain exceptional individuals in the dehumanized class *provide them with something they want* (often, emotional validation.) It’s not actual recognition of a mutual soul, it’s a day-pass for their lap dog.
So instead I’m tempted to suggest it’s closer to “but they *like* their LLMs better than other non-alive classes of person.”
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@VeeRat
I’ve been listening to the new Behind The Bastards (podcast) about the intersection between LLM usage and cult-like thinking (paraphrasing). This kind of thinking is more powerful and more widespread than I’d appreciated. -
I struggled to dismiss the ideas of solipsism as a teenager, and since I've seen how people gravitate to LLMs a large factor in why that was has become clear to me... The people I was interacting with were largely alienated from their own conscious experience, likely through training. I've never had this problem interacting with children. edit: at least ones that haven't been raised by phones.
@theeclecticdyslexic @VeeRat I had almost the reverse struggle in that I reflexively wondered about the umwelt of every other living being on the planet from small childhood, got little more than parental handwringing for my questions, and felt unreasonably vindicated when someone finally saw the need for and coined a word to express it (at least among fellow H. sapiens) in the ‘teens:
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@VeeRat
I’ve been listening to the new Behind The Bastards (podcast) about the intersection between LLM usage and cult-like thinking (paraphrasing). This kind of thinking is more powerful and more widespread than I’d appreciated.@sollat sounds interesting
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I'm so disheartened about my job. We had a training about AI, and the person presenting just sounded so in love with it. Not as in appreciating a good tool to use, not like loving a new tool. She was actually in love with it, and even admitted to the need to stop thinking of AI as if it's a real person.
She excitedly talked about human-like responses to her prompts, as if someone she has a crush on gave her attention.
When I talk about my dislike for AI, how it can't be used ethically, how flawed it can be, I'm telling people that their crush is evil. They are reacting in a predictable way: with anger and hurt. It's an emotional topic.
Talking about a set of code shouldn't be this emotional. The data centers that are the beating hearts of their love interests get a pass from them; they would destroy the whole planet to maintain this dopamine high and in fact they are gladly doing so.
@VeeRat not for nothing but this is like saying that people who use plastic straws are responsible for destroying the environment.
No matter what you feel about people who are falling into tendencies of addiction wrt AI, or the underlying issues that lead someone to emotional attachment to a system rather than a person (fascism brought us here), it is the corporations and the billionaires propping it up who are at fault. Who built these systems with disregard for the environment.
Also "slop", as I've just learned today, is derived from "goyslop" which is a nazi phrase
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I'm so disheartened about my job. We had a training about AI, and the person presenting just sounded so in love with it. Not as in appreciating a good tool to use, not like loving a new tool. She was actually in love with it, and even admitted to the need to stop thinking of AI as if it's a real person.
She excitedly talked about human-like responses to her prompts, as if someone she has a crush on gave her attention.
When I talk about my dislike for AI, how it can't be used ethically, how flawed it can be, I'm telling people that their crush is evil. They are reacting in a predictable way: with anger and hurt. It's an emotional topic.
Talking about a set of code shouldn't be this emotional. The data centers that are the beating hearts of their love interests get a pass from them; they would destroy the whole planet to maintain this dopamine high and in fact they are gladly doing so.
@VeeRat reframe it as "AIs parents are evil"?
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I'm so disheartened about my job. We had a training about AI, and the person presenting just sounded so in love with it. Not as in appreciating a good tool to use, not like loving a new tool. She was actually in love with it, and even admitted to the need to stop thinking of AI as if it's a real person.
She excitedly talked about human-like responses to her prompts, as if someone she has a crush on gave her attention.
When I talk about my dislike for AI, how it can't be used ethically, how flawed it can be, I'm telling people that their crush is evil. They are reacting in a predictable way: with anger and hurt. It's an emotional topic.
Talking about a set of code shouldn't be this emotional. The data centers that are the beating hearts of their love interests get a pass from them; they would destroy the whole planet to maintain this dopamine high and in fact they are gladly doing so.
@VeeRat When this is over, there's going to be a need to have slop-intoxicated people in some sort of rehab-style educational thing to get their brains back in working order because of all the damage caused by the slopmachines.
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@theeclecticdyslexic @VeeRat I had almost the reverse struggle in that I reflexively wondered about the umwelt of every other living being on the planet from small childhood, got little more than parental handwringing for my questions, and felt unreasonably vindicated when someone finally saw the need for and coined a word to express it (at least among fellow H. sapiens) in the ‘teens:
Sorry to hear about the relatable experience of adult figures unequipped to handle difficult questions...
I often feared I was thoughts floating alone in aether. The concept was distressing to 15 year old me; it felt accurate. I eventually decided the only way to live was to choose to act as though that isn't true, even just for myself.
Years later learned about the "brain in a vat"!
I find the feeling of sonder very reassuring.
Thanks for the great conversation! -
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@VeeRat
I’ve been listening to the new Behind The Bastards (podcast) about the intersection between LLM usage and cult-like thinking (paraphrasing). This kind of thinking is more powerful and more widespread than I’d appreciated. -
I'm so disheartened about my job. We had a training about AI, and the person presenting just sounded so in love with it. Not as in appreciating a good tool to use, not like loving a new tool. She was actually in love with it, and even admitted to the need to stop thinking of AI as if it's a real person.
She excitedly talked about human-like responses to her prompts, as if someone she has a crush on gave her attention.
When I talk about my dislike for AI, how it can't be used ethically, how flawed it can be, I'm telling people that their crush is evil. They are reacting in a predictable way: with anger and hurt. It's an emotional topic.
Talking about a set of code shouldn't be this emotional. The data centers that are the beating hearts of their love interests get a pass from them; they would destroy the whole planet to maintain this dopamine high and in fact they are gladly doing so.
@VeeRat (employing the Socratic method...) "so you'd obviously want total privacy in your interactions with this entity?" "Right?"
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I'm so disheartened about my job. We had a training about AI, and the person presenting just sounded so in love with it. Not as in appreciating a good tool to use, not like loving a new tool. She was actually in love with it, and even admitted to the need to stop thinking of AI as if it's a real person.
She excitedly talked about human-like responses to her prompts, as if someone she has a crush on gave her attention.
When I talk about my dislike for AI, how it can't be used ethically, how flawed it can be, I'm telling people that their crush is evil. They are reacting in a predictable way: with anger and hurt. It's an emotional topic.
Talking about a set of code shouldn't be this emotional. The data centers that are the beating hearts of their love interests get a pass from them; they would destroy the whole planet to maintain this dopamine high and in fact they are gladly doing so.
@VeeRat there's something religion-like in this
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I'm so disheartened about my job. We had a training about AI, and the person presenting just sounded so in love with it. Not as in appreciating a good tool to use, not like loving a new tool. She was actually in love with it, and even admitted to the need to stop thinking of AI as if it's a real person.
She excitedly talked about human-like responses to her prompts, as if someone she has a crush on gave her attention.
When I talk about my dislike for AI, how it can't be used ethically, how flawed it can be, I'm telling people that their crush is evil. They are reacting in a predictable way: with anger and hurt. It's an emotional topic.
Talking about a set of code shouldn't be this emotional. The data centers that are the beating hearts of their love interests get a pass from them; they would destroy the whole planet to maintain this dopamine high and in fact they are gladly doing so.
@VeeRat When I hear such stories (a horror for me), I ask myself how much the techbros of the #AI corporations abuse people's growing loneliness and isolation with the purpose to alienate societies even more. The more they divide humans from real humans, the better they can install their fsscist ideas. And it works best by emotions/cultist promises.
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@VeeRat
I’ve been listening to the new Behind The Bastards (podcast) about the intersection between LLM usage and cult-like thinking (paraphrasing). This kind of thinking is more powerful and more widespread than I’d appreciated.@sollat @VeeRat
that article they mention on #behindthebastards, with this #openAI investor going into #AIpsychosis (from #chatGPT remixing #SCP #scifi stories), is worth a read too. i suspect many users suffer from a milder version of this.
https://futurism.com/openai-investor-chatgpt-mental-health -
I think when people make this perspective clear, I think they are telling on themselves about how their internal thought processes work. It shows a lack of curiousity about the world and everything in it, imo. They live in a mental miasma, bumbling from stimuli to stimuli. They have incredibly weak theory of mind, so weak that they don't even appreciate their own.
@theeclecticdyslexic I could imagine other reasons too. It works like a cult: they try to grab people in difficult situations like loneliness, isolation, perhaps sudden illness, or only doubts, feeling overwhelmed by world problems ... people hunger for a simple solutions. Then comes the cult playing the friendly, promising community ...
It's also a problem of a society not giving alternatives to the cult. -
@theeclecticdyslexic I could imagine other reasons too. It works like a cult: they try to grab people in difficult situations like loneliness, isolation, perhaps sudden illness, or only doubts, feeling overwhelmed by world problems ... people hunger for a simple solutions. Then comes the cult playing the friendly, promising community ...
It's also a problem of a society not giving alternatives to the cult.Oh definitely. There are clearly several distinct cults at play here.
The rationalists and effective altruists. They are basically Evangelical Christians that swap god for "AI".
The business idiots and world leaders that treat this like a cargo cult, and oppotunity to monetise thought.
The average people, isolated by our modern society... having their lonliness and cognitive burnout monetized.
No matter how you slice it, society is failing so many people.
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@VeeRat When this is over, there's going to be a need to have slop-intoxicated people in some sort of rehab-style educational thing to get their brains back in working order because of all the damage caused by the slopmachines.
@DrewNaylor @VeeRat We have these structures for people who escape cults or extremist ideologies. But they can tell you about the hard work and what the trauma destroyed in the life of the people who seek for help.
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I'm so disheartened about my job. We had a training about AI, and the person presenting just sounded so in love with it. Not as in appreciating a good tool to use, not like loving a new tool. She was actually in love with it, and even admitted to the need to stop thinking of AI as if it's a real person.
She excitedly talked about human-like responses to her prompts, as if someone she has a crush on gave her attention.
When I talk about my dislike for AI, how it can't be used ethically, how flawed it can be, I'm telling people that their crush is evil. They are reacting in a predictable way: with anger and hurt. It's an emotional topic.
Talking about a set of code shouldn't be this emotional. The data centers that are the beating hearts of their love interests get a pass from them; they would destroy the whole planet to maintain this dopamine high and in fact they are gladly doing so.
@VeeRat this person needs, like, serious mental therapy? Have a look at https://sharewellnow.com (disclaimer, we are investors in this company, because I don't know how to reach people in this condition any other way, and I want everyone to have access to therapy with as few barriers as possible.)
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@VeeRat not for nothing but this is like saying that people who use plastic straws are responsible for destroying the environment.
No matter what you feel about people who are falling into tendencies of addiction wrt AI, or the underlying issues that lead someone to emotional attachment to a system rather than a person (fascism brought us here), it is the corporations and the billionaires propping it up who are at fault. Who built these systems with disregard for the environment.
Also "slop", as I've just learned today, is derived from "goyslop" which is a nazi phrase
@cmdr_nova @VeeRat "+1 favourite" for the comment about corporations' and billionaires' fault.
Regarding the etymology: sorry, what?! Slop originates from old english with cognates in other germanic language: https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/slop
There's no way it derive *from* a meme first attested in 2016 according to knowyourmeme. -
@cmdr_nova @VeeRat "+1 favourite" for the comment about corporations' and billionaires' fault.
Regarding the etymology: sorry, what?! Slop originates from old english with cognates in other germanic language: https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/slop
There's no way it derive *from* a meme first attested in 2016 according to knowyourmeme.@dryak @VeeRat Ah yes, defaulting to old english because you'd rather not acknowledge that language changes and fascists using language as a weapon is bad
just like how random people use "triggered" as a way to describe others being upset, and call people "NPCs", as if they weren't trends and phrases adopted and spread, by nazis
