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  3. Adults lose skills to AI; Children never build them.

Adults lose skills to AI; Children never build them.

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  • cwebber@social.coopC cwebber@social.coop

    Adults lose skills to AI; Children never build them. https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/the-algorithmic-mind/202603/adults-lose-skills-to-ai-children-never-build-them

    moss@beige.partyM This user is from outside of this forum
    moss@beige.partyM This user is from outside of this forum
    moss@beige.party
    wrote last edited by
    #27

    @cwebber It’s compounded by prior generations of decreasing education in arts and humanities, leading to adults (parents) who themselves did not learn creative thinking, ethics, or different cultures. I remember 20 years ago a comp sci professor complaining that his university was churning out tech grads with terrible communication skills. Those are now the “45 year olds” whose abilities atrophy “but could recover”. Their kids didn’t stand a chance against AI.

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    • cwebber@social.coopC cwebber@social.coop

      Adults lose skills to AI; Children never build them. https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/the-algorithmic-mind/202603/adults-lose-skills-to-ai-children-never-build-them

      lemgandi@mastodon.socialL This user is from outside of this forum
      lemgandi@mastodon.socialL This user is from outside of this forum
      lemgandi@mastodon.social
      wrote last edited by
      #28

      @cwebber I filed this under "Interesting if true". I'd love to believe it.

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      • cwebber@social.coopC cwebber@social.coop

        Adults lose skills to AI; Children never build them. https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/the-algorithmic-mind/202603/adults-lose-skills-to-ai-children-never-build-them

        xs4me2@mastodon.socialX This user is from outside of this forum
        xs4me2@mastodon.socialX This user is from outside of this forum
        xs4me2@mastodon.social
        wrote last edited by
        #29

        @cwebber

        Worrying…

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        • aatch@mastodon.nzA This user is from outside of this forum
          aatch@mastodon.nzA This user is from outside of this forum
          aatch@mastodon.nz
          wrote last edited by
          #30

          @PattyHanson that's not really the same thing. Checks have been getting rarer and rarer for decades. I haven't seen a check in almost 20 years. Something that was important for you to understand when you were younger just isn't true for your grandson. Your son probably hasn't needed to use a check for a long time either and therefore teaching his kids about them just never came up. He's not failing because he didn't deliberately sit them down and explain what a check is.

          eniko@mastodon.gamedev.placeE 1 Reply Last reply
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          • C clickymcticker@hachyderm.io

            @lizzard @KatLS @cwebber Many schools try. It’s not easy to teach critical thinking. My school certainly tried to teach me, but I was an awful student. I thankfully had a family who found ways to make sure I learned that, if nothing else.

            lizzard@social.tchncs.deL This user is from outside of this forum
            lizzard@social.tchncs.deL This user is from outside of this forum
            lizzard@social.tchncs.de
            wrote last edited by
            #31

            @ClickyMcTicker @KatLS @cwebber many teachers try. I'm not so sure about the system as a whole. I'm not even thinking about the US here, I'm not from there. Just as a general class education thing.

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            • cwebber@social.coopC cwebber@social.coop

              Adults lose skills to AI; Children never build them. https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/the-algorithmic-mind/202603/adults-lose-skills-to-ai-children-never-build-them

              tuban_muzuru@beige.partyT This user is from outside of this forum
              tuban_muzuru@beige.partyT This user is from outside of this forum
              tuban_muzuru@beige.party
              wrote last edited by
              #32

              @cwebber

              Considering that the humans are doing an absolutely terrible job, I figure the AI systems can at least be measured....

              Link Preview Image
              NAEP Reading: National Average Scores

              NAEP Report Card: Reading

              favicon

              (www.nationsreportcard.gov)

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              • cwebber@social.coopC cwebber@social.coop

                Adults lose skills to AI; Children never build them. https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/the-algorithmic-mind/202603/adults-lose-skills-to-ai-children-never-build-them

                leckse@social.leckse.netL This user is from outside of this forum
                leckse@social.leckse.netL This user is from outside of this forum
                leckse@social.leckse.net
                wrote last edited by
                #33

                @cwebber Algorithmic complacency kills curiosity and eventually free will.

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                • cwebber@social.coopC cwebber@social.coop

                  Adults lose skills to AI; Children never build them. https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/the-algorithmic-mind/202603/adults-lose-skills-to-ai-children-never-build-them

                  aeva@mastodon.gamedev.placeA This user is from outside of this forum
                  aeva@mastodon.gamedev.placeA This user is from outside of this forum
                  aeva@mastodon.gamedev.place
                  wrote last edited by
                  #34

                  @cwebber i saw that the other day. I found the author's aside about how they use it to summarize "hundreds" of papers a bit alarming.

                  aceryz@social.hackerspace.plA eniko@mastodon.gamedev.placeE 2 Replies Last reply
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                  • koen_hufkens@mastodon.socialK koen_hufkens@mastodon.social

                    @ai6yr @cwebber When mentoring students I often get the question - how do you figure things out so quickly.

                    Then I tell them that I've been messing with hardware and software since I was in my early teens - and I made tons of (innocent) mistakes.

                    When you get to be an adult you then know how to approach complex systems where you might not have this much margin.

                    Much of it is heuristics. Offloading heuristics (despite biases) is a VERY BAD IDEA.

                    davebauerart@mastodon.socialD This user is from outside of this forum
                    davebauerart@mastodon.socialD This user is from outside of this forum
                    davebauerart@mastodon.social
                    wrote last edited by
                    #35

                    @koen_hufkens @ai6yr @cwebber Everything I ever did for a job was noticing patterns and applying them in new situations.

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                    • aeva@mastodon.gamedev.placeA aeva@mastodon.gamedev.place

                      @cwebber i saw that the other day. I found the author's aside about how they use it to summarize "hundreds" of papers a bit alarming.

                      aceryz@social.hackerspace.plA This user is from outside of this forum
                      aceryz@social.hackerspace.plA This user is from outside of this forum
                      aceryz@social.hackerspace.pl
                      wrote last edited by
                      #36

                      @aeva @cwebber yes, he seems way too optimistic about the situation of "adults", himself included, using this technology.

                      Meanwhile, my university is making LLMs available for students on its platforms with the reasoning, quote:

                      "The available tools are intended to be used responsibly and treated as support in the process of acquiring knowledge and developing one’s own skills."

                      ... and I want to eat my hat. Students supposed to develop their research skill are sąbotaged by the university.

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                      • aeva@mastodon.gamedev.placeA aeva@mastodon.gamedev.place

                        @cwebber i saw that the other day. I found the author's aside about how they use it to summarize "hundreds" of papers a bit alarming.

                        eniko@mastodon.gamedev.placeE This user is from outside of this forum
                        eniko@mastodon.gamedev.placeE This user is from outside of this forum
                        eniko@mastodon.gamedev.place
                        wrote last edited by
                        #37

                        @aeva @cwebber yeah there was a lot of very confident "well it's okay if *i* do it, i can always spot the problems!"

                        it's like. can you though. can you spot the problems you didn't spot though. how would that work, exactly

                        emi@social.comfy.cityE 1 Reply Last reply
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                        • aatch@mastodon.nzA aatch@mastodon.nz

                          @PattyHanson that's not really the same thing. Checks have been getting rarer and rarer for decades. I haven't seen a check in almost 20 years. Something that was important for you to understand when you were younger just isn't true for your grandson. Your son probably hasn't needed to use a check for a long time either and therefore teaching his kids about them just never came up. He's not failing because he didn't deliberately sit them down and explain what a check is.

                          eniko@mastodon.gamedev.placeE This user is from outside of this forum
                          eniko@mastodon.gamedev.placeE This user is from outside of this forum
                          eniko@mastodon.gamedev.place
                          wrote last edited by
                          #38

                          @aatch @PattyHanson i went my entire life without seeing a paper check until i moved to the US

                          i'm in my 40s

                          kimsj@mastodon.socialK timjan@social.linux.pizzaT 2 Replies Last reply
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                          • eniko@mastodon.gamedev.placeE eniko@mastodon.gamedev.place

                            @aatch @PattyHanson i went my entire life without seeing a paper check until i moved to the US

                            i'm in my 40s

                            kimsj@mastodon.socialK This user is from outside of this forum
                            kimsj@mastodon.socialK This user is from outside of this forum
                            kimsj@mastodon.social
                            wrote last edited by
                            #39

                            @eniko @aatch @PattyHanson
                            Mischievously, I suggest that the failure is of the cheque writer, who hasn’t kept up his education enough to know how to do a bank transfer. 😜

                            pattyhanson@mastodon.socialP 1 Reply Last reply
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                            • eniko@mastodon.gamedev.placeE eniko@mastodon.gamedev.place

                              @aeva @cwebber yeah there was a lot of very confident "well it's okay if *i* do it, i can always spot the problems!"

                              it's like. can you though. can you spot the problems you didn't spot though. how would that work, exactly

                              emi@social.comfy.cityE This user is from outside of this forum
                              emi@social.comfy.cityE This user is from outside of this forum
                              emi@social.comfy.city
                              wrote last edited by
                              #40

                              @eniko @aeva @cwebber He even talks about this with children - children cannot spot problems they never encountered before, but an adult learns with every new thing they see too which has the same exact problems and summaries will inevitably omit certain things you may find problematic as a human.

                              aeva@mastodon.gamedev.placeA 1 Reply Last reply
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                              • cwebber@social.coopC cwebber@social.coop

                                Adults lose skills to AI; Children never build them. https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/the-algorithmic-mind/202603/adults-lose-skills-to-ai-children-never-build-them

                                hugoestr@functional.cafeH This user is from outside of this forum
                                hugoestr@functional.cafeH This user is from outside of this forum
                                hugoestr@functional.cafe
                                wrote last edited by
                                #41

                                @cwebber Being forced to use it, it feels different

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                                • eniko@mastodon.gamedev.placeE eniko@mastodon.gamedev.place

                                  @aatch @PattyHanson i went my entire life without seeing a paper check until i moved to the US

                                  i'm in my 40s

                                  timjan@social.linux.pizzaT This user is from outside of this forum
                                  timjan@social.linux.pizzaT This user is from outside of this forum
                                  timjan@social.linux.pizza
                                  wrote last edited by
                                  #42

                                  @eniko @aatch @PattyHanson

                                  I'm of a similar age, and likewise didn't grow up in the US, but I did see checks occasionally used until I was maybe 10yo?

                                  1 Reply Last reply
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                                  • kimsj@mastodon.socialK kimsj@mastodon.social

                                    @eniko @aatch @PattyHanson
                                    Mischievously, I suggest that the failure is of the cheque writer, who hasn’t kept up his education enough to know how to do a bank transfer. 😜

                                    pattyhanson@mastodon.socialP This user is from outside of this forum
                                    pattyhanson@mastodon.socialP This user is from outside of this forum
                                    pattyhanson@mastodon.social
                                    wrote last edited by
                                    #43

                                    @KimSJ @eniko @aatch As a grandmother and the check writer, I choose not to gift via bank transfer or PayPal or any of the other modern methods to transfer money. When a kid opens a birthday card expecting money, they don't get the same excitement from a proof of bank transfer that they do when they see cash. Turns out, checks aren't that exciting either.

                                    kimsj@mastodon.socialK 1 Reply Last reply
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                                    • emi@social.comfy.cityE emi@social.comfy.city

                                      @eniko @aeva @cwebber He even talks about this with children - children cannot spot problems they never encountered before, but an adult learns with every new thing they see too which has the same exact problems and summaries will inevitably omit certain things you may find problematic as a human.

                                      aeva@mastodon.gamedev.placeA This user is from outside of this forum
                                      aeva@mastodon.gamedev.placeA This user is from outside of this forum
                                      aeva@mastodon.gamedev.place
                                      wrote last edited by
                                      #44

                                      @emi @eniko @cwebber there's also the problem (which iirc the author overlooks) which is what happens when someone repeatedly internalizes noise that statistically resembles information. even if you have the skill to theoretically spot a specific inaccuracy, what happens when you read misinformation restated hundreds of different ways? what happens if you repeatedly scan it without much thought because you're in a hurry?

                                      aeva@mastodon.gamedev.placeA 1 Reply Last reply
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                                      • aeva@mastodon.gamedev.placeA aeva@mastodon.gamedev.place

                                        @emi @eniko @cwebber there's also the problem (which iirc the author overlooks) which is what happens when someone repeatedly internalizes noise that statistically resembles information. even if you have the skill to theoretically spot a specific inaccuracy, what happens when you read misinformation restated hundreds of different ways? what happens if you repeatedly scan it without much thought because you're in a hurry?

                                        aeva@mastodon.gamedev.placeA This user is from outside of this forum
                                        aeva@mastodon.gamedev.placeA This user is from outside of this forum
                                        aeva@mastodon.gamedev.place
                                        wrote last edited by
                                        #45

                                        @emi @eniko @cwebber I imagine the way this works is the skill erosion happens at the edge of your understanding where you can't easily spot it and works its way inward until you don't know anything anymore

                                        aeva@mastodon.gamedev.placeA 1 Reply Last reply
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                                        • aeva@mastodon.gamedev.placeA aeva@mastodon.gamedev.place

                                          @emi @eniko @cwebber I imagine the way this works is the skill erosion happens at the edge of your understanding where you can't easily spot it and works its way inward until you don't know anything anymore

                                          aeva@mastodon.gamedev.placeA This user is from outside of this forum
                                          aeva@mastodon.gamedev.placeA This user is from outside of this forum
                                          aeva@mastodon.gamedev.place
                                          wrote last edited by
                                          #46

                                          @emi @eniko @cwebber and if you really are taking the time to fact check every little thing it says, there is no way there is any efficiency benefit to using the slop machine

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