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  3. Reading a claude.md and seeing written there many directives like this: "Don't make changes until you have 95% confidence in what you need to build."

Reading a claude.md and seeing written there many directives like this: "Don't make changes until you have 95% confidence in what you need to build."

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  • cammerman@mstdn.socialC cammerman@mstdn.social

    Reading a claude.md and seeing written there many directives like this: "Don't make changes until you have 95% confidence in what you need to build."

    This reveals such a profound misunderstanding of how this technology works that I'm speechless. And this is literally what people are trying to build fully-automated "software factories" from.

    ardvaark@mastodon.worldA This user is from outside of this forum
    ardvaark@mastodon.worldA This user is from outside of this forum
    ardvaark@mastodon.world
    wrote last edited by
    #3

    @cammerman I'm at best 50/50 on what I need to build before I start making changes. ๐Ÿ˜…

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    • cammerman@mstdn.socialC cammerman@mstdn.social

      Reading a claude.md and seeing written there many directives like this: "Don't make changes until you have 95% confidence in what you need to build."

      This reveals such a profound misunderstanding of how this technology works that I'm speechless. And this is literally what people are trying to build fully-automated "software factories" from.

      pmonks@sfba.socialP This user is from outside of this forum
      pmonks@sfba.socialP This user is from outside of this forum
      pmonks@sfba.social
      wrote last edited by
      #4

      @cammerman @mhoye I donโ€™t suppose I could impose upon you to give mine a quick review? https://github.com/pmonks/wreck/blob/dev/AGENTS.md

      not2b@sfba.socialN 1 Reply Last reply
      0
      • cammerman@mstdn.socialC cammerman@mstdn.social

        Look, if you tell an LLM it needs 95% confidence, it doesn't know what either "95%" nor "confidence" means. It knows people tend to respond to this kind of direction either by saying "I'm not sure enough because..." or "I'm super confident for these reasons." It has no ability to correctly choose which of those templates it will follow.

        Flip a coin. You'll get a reasonable looking sentence back in one of those styles, with a random assortment of reasons that may or may not be rooted in fact.

        pseudonym@mastodon.onlineP This user is from outside of this forum
        pseudonym@mastodon.onlineP This user is from outside of this forum
        pseudonym@mastodon.online
        wrote last edited by
        #5

        @cammerman

        This is an all too common failure mode (of humans). The system is working as designed, being a next most probable token generator.

        What I keep encountering is humans failing to grasp that the LLM has no world model, and no sense whatsoever of "meaning" or "truth" of anything, ever.

        Because a lot of world model, truth-based, reasoning is implicitly encoded in language, frequently true things are probable next tokens.

        This makes humans think "understanding" happens. It doesn't.

        nielsa@mas.toN 1 Reply Last reply
        0
        • cammerman@mstdn.socialC cammerman@mstdn.social

          Look, if you tell an LLM it needs 95% confidence, it doesn't know what either "95%" nor "confidence" means. It knows people tend to respond to this kind of direction either by saying "I'm not sure enough because..." or "I'm super confident for these reasons." It has no ability to correctly choose which of those templates it will follow.

          Flip a coin. You'll get a reasonable looking sentence back in one of those styles, with a random assortment of reasons that may or may not be rooted in fact.

          cammerman@mstdn.socialC This user is from outside of this forum
          cammerman@mstdn.socialC This user is from outside of this forum
          cammerman@mstdn.social
          wrote last edited by
          #6

          No matter how many prompt contexts you stack up and fire off in parallel, the machine cannot find truth, cannot do math, cannot know things, or reason.

          It's Massively Multiplayer Online Autocomplete.

          The fact that the capital and executive class thinks this is sufficient to replace most of the world's knowledge workers tells you all you need to know about how we should be dealing with them, and all of this.

          lnklnx@social.lnklnx.comL 1 Reply Last reply
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          • pseudonym@mastodon.onlineP pseudonym@mastodon.online

            @cammerman

            This is an all too common failure mode (of humans). The system is working as designed, being a next most probable token generator.

            What I keep encountering is humans failing to grasp that the LLM has no world model, and no sense whatsoever of "meaning" or "truth" of anything, ever.

            Because a lot of world model, truth-based, reasoning is implicitly encoded in language, frequently true things are probable next tokens.

            This makes humans think "understanding" happens. It doesn't.

            nielsa@mas.toN This user is from outside of this forum
            nielsa@mas.toN This user is from outside of this forum
            nielsa@mas.to
            wrote last edited by
            #7

            @pseudonym @cammerman If you ask the magic 8-ball about frequently truthfully described or discussed things, or things of similar structure with a clear mapping, it's more likely to produce a correct answer, but you have no idea what's frequently described and whether it's just randomly wrong. Oh, and if it is wrong, it is optimized to make the wrong answer look right in context. Good luck.

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            • pmonks@sfba.socialP pmonks@sfba.social

              @cammerman @mhoye I donโ€™t suppose I could impose upon you to give mine a quick review? https://github.com/pmonks/wreck/blob/dev/AGENTS.md

              not2b@sfba.socialN This user is from outside of this forum
              not2b@sfba.socialN This user is from outside of this forum
              not2b@sfba.social
              wrote last edited by
              #8

              @pmonks @cammerman @mhoye I'm curious to see some of the limericks that are generated by these instructions.

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              • cammerman@mstdn.socialC This user is from outside of this forum
                cammerman@mstdn.socialC This user is from outside of this forum
                cammerman@mstdn.social
                wrote last edited by
                #9

                @pmonks @not2b @mhoye

                ๐Ÿ˜˜๐Ÿ‘Œ No notes.

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                • cammerman@mstdn.socialC cammerman@mstdn.social

                  Look, if you tell an LLM it needs 95% confidence, it doesn't know what either "95%" nor "confidence" means. It knows people tend to respond to this kind of direction either by saying "I'm not sure enough because..." or "I'm super confident for these reasons." It has no ability to correctly choose which of those templates it will follow.

                  Flip a coin. You'll get a reasonable looking sentence back in one of those styles, with a random assortment of reasons that may or may not be rooted in fact.

                  walrus@toot.walesW This user is from outside of this forum
                  walrus@toot.walesW This user is from outside of this forum
                  walrus@toot.wales
                  wrote last edited by
                  #10

                  @cammerman

                  They don't KNOW anything, full stop.

                  They're just autocorrect on steroids.

                  1 Reply Last reply
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                  • cammerman@mstdn.socialC cammerman@mstdn.social

                    Look, if you tell an LLM it needs 95% confidence, it doesn't know what either "95%" nor "confidence" means. It knows people tend to respond to this kind of direction either by saying "I'm not sure enough because..." or "I'm super confident for these reasons." It has no ability to correctly choose which of those templates it will follow.

                    Flip a coin. You'll get a reasonable looking sentence back in one of those styles, with a random assortment of reasons that may or may not be rooted in fact.

                    individeweal@mas.toI This user is from outside of this forum
                    individeweal@mas.toI This user is from outside of this forum
                    individeweal@mas.to
                    wrote last edited by
                    #11

                    @cammerman Possibly more important, it doesn't know what "don't" means. I'm not even making a philosophical point about what it is to "know" something, even if we only care about output, it doesn't act in a way that corresponds to following an instruction not to do anything. Don't mention goblins: no effect on how often goblins get mentioned if the training was weighted towards mentioning creatures.

                    rndanger@infosec.exchangeR 1 Reply Last reply
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                    • cammerman@mstdn.socialC cammerman@mstdn.social

                      Reading a claude.md and seeing written there many directives like this: "Don't make changes until you have 95% confidence in what you need to build."

                      This reveals such a profound misunderstanding of how this technology works that I'm speechless. And this is literally what people are trying to build fully-automated "software factories" from.

                      gildilinie@beige.partyG This user is from outside of this forum
                      gildilinie@beige.partyG This user is from outside of this forum
                      gildilinie@beige.party
                      wrote last edited by
                      #12

                      @cammerman https://beige.party/@gildilinie/116500174248274955

                      1 Reply Last reply
                      0
                      • individeweal@mas.toI individeweal@mas.to

                        @cammerman Possibly more important, it doesn't know what "don't" means. I'm not even making a philosophical point about what it is to "know" something, even if we only care about output, it doesn't act in a way that corresponds to following an instruction not to do anything. Don't mention goblins: no effect on how often goblins get mentioned if the training was weighted towards mentioning creatures.

                        rndanger@infosec.exchangeR This user is from outside of this forum
                        rndanger@infosec.exchangeR This user is from outside of this forum
                        rndanger@infosec.exchange
                        wrote last edited by
                        #13

                        @individeweal @cammerman
                        I told ChatGPT "don't apologize" so it apologized for apologizing.

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                        0
                        • cammerman@mstdn.socialC cammerman@mstdn.social

                          Reading a claude.md and seeing written there many directives like this: "Don't make changes until you have 95% confidence in what you need to build."

                          This reveals such a profound misunderstanding of how this technology works that I'm speechless. And this is literally what people are trying to build fully-automated "software factories" from.

                          petersommerlad@mastodon.socialP This user is from outside of this forum
                          petersommerlad@mastodon.socialP This user is from outside of this forum
                          petersommerlad@mastodon.social
                          wrote last edited by
                          #14

                          Retterin der Autoindustrie (Chinas)

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                          • cammerman@mstdn.socialC cammerman@mstdn.social

                            No matter how many prompt contexts you stack up and fire off in parallel, the machine cannot find truth, cannot do math, cannot know things, or reason.

                            It's Massively Multiplayer Online Autocomplete.

                            The fact that the capital and executive class thinks this is sufficient to replace most of the world's knowledge workers tells you all you need to know about how we should be dealing with them, and all of this.

                            lnklnx@social.lnklnx.comL This user is from outside of this forum
                            lnklnx@social.lnklnx.comL This user is from outside of this forum
                            lnklnx@social.lnklnx.com
                            wrote last edited by
                            #15

                            @cammerman "Massively Multiplayer Online Autocomplete", lol

                            I am officially calling it this from now on!

                            1 Reply Last reply
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