KDE supports the "Keep Android Open" campaign
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@Stem @kde @fdroidorg @keepandroidopen so do you think that we should comply?
@Fokeu @kde @fdroidorg @keepandroidopen It's not like we had any other choice.
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@Stem
No. But to keep the mouth shut and let it happen quietly is not an option.@simondeutschl @kde @fdroidorg @keepandroidopen Any option will lead to the same result, so what does it matter?
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KDE supports the "Keep Android Open" campaign
#Google will cut off independent developers to #Android if they do not register with Google first. This will kill independent platforms like @fdroidorg and severely impede FLOSS devs from creating apps for Android.
Keep Android Open
Advocating for Android as a free, open platform for everyone to build apps on.
(keepandroidopen.org)
Many KDE apps are deployed for Android: KDE Connect, Itinerary, Tokodon, and there's even a test version of Krita for Android.
KDE calls on Google to reverse course and @keepandroidopen.
An Open Letter to Google regarding Mandatory Developer Registration for Android App Distribution
Open Letter to Google Regarding Mandatory Developer Registration for Third-Party App Distribution
(keepandroidopen.org)
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@Stem @kde @fdroidorg @keepandroidopen Perhaps, but what does it cost to try?
@olivenolje @kde @fdroidorg @keepandroidopen Giving people false hope with an action that have no chance to have any meaningful result.
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It costs a missed opportunity to give more appropriate advice: stay away from google and use more private community forks of android that if I understand correctly will not be affected by googles papers please app ecosystem.
A strategy focusing on begging tech giants to not do the will of capital is basically lying to the public that there is a chance this can work.
In theory yes the open letter is a nice thing to have regardless of how google reacts because then we have something to point to how google is ignoring public opinion - but it needs to be presented with heavy caveats and we need to focus on getting average people out of googles grip so they don't hold this much power over us
@ambiguous_yelp @olivenolje @kde I couldn't have said it better.
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It costs a missed opportunity to give more appropriate advice: stay away from google and use more private community forks of android that if I understand correctly will not be affected by googles papers please app ecosystem.
A strategy focusing on begging tech giants to not do the will of capital is basically lying to the public that there is a chance this can work.
In theory yes the open letter is a nice thing to have regardless of how google reacts because then we have something to point to how google is ignoring public opinion - but it needs to be presented with heavy caveats and we need to focus on getting average people out of googles grip so they don't hold this much power over us
@ambiguous_yelp @kde Fair point.
However, if we insist on using Android (forks), we're still impacted by Google's decisions. Sooner or later, these forks will be less and less of a valid option (cf. how google's changes to the Pixel 10 series were a pain for the Grapheneos team).
Even if this letter fails, we shouldn't simply stick our heads in sand and look away from these issues. As you mentioned, raising public awareness is critical. So is fighting against their control.
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@kde @fdroidorg @keepandroidopen Do you really think a company that lick the boots of a fascist dictator will give a damn about this open letter, let alone the openness of its own products?
@Stem @kde @fdroidorg @keepandroidopen So let's stand aside while the world burns, right? What's the point of fighting for anything any more?
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@Stem @kde @fdroidorg @keepandroidopen So let's stand aside while the world burns, right? What's the point of fighting for anything any more?
@kilgoretrout @kde @fdroidorg @keepandroidopen Don't expect to win a fight against a supertank if your only weapon is a fistful of tiny stones.
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@ambiguous_yelp @kde Fair point.
However, if we insist on using Android (forks), we're still impacted by Google's decisions. Sooner or later, these forks will be less and less of a valid option (cf. how google's changes to the Pixel 10 series were a pain for the Grapheneos team).
Even if this letter fails, we shouldn't simply stick our heads in sand and look away from these issues. As you mentioned, raising public awareness is critical. So is fighting against their control.
I expect hardware to become more locked down, this is what states and capital want. The best solution to that continues to be open source hardware and modular devices.
I believe this because open source hardware and modular devices create power at a grassroots level and invites tighter crackdowns from governments - but there is a political limit to how oppressive a regime can be and the more power we build for ourselves the more expensive it will be for them to stop us using unapproved apps which slows the whole oppressive system down
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It costs a missed opportunity to give more appropriate advice: stay away from google and use more private community forks of android that if I understand correctly will not be affected by googles papers please app ecosystem.
A strategy focusing on begging tech giants to not do the will of capital is basically lying to the public that there is a chance this can work.
In theory yes the open letter is a nice thing to have regardless of how google reacts because then we have something to point to how google is ignoring public opinion - but it needs to be presented with heavy caveats and we need to focus on getting average people out of googles grip so they don't hold this much power over us
@ambiguous_yelp @olivenolje @kde One issue with using custom ROMs is device availability. I wanted to use an alternative OS instead of stock Android, but most devices supported by CalyxOS (which is currently on hold) and LineageOS are no longer available for purchase in my country. The ideal option would be to buy a Google Pixel and use GrapheneOS, but unfortunately, it's not available in my country either. I wouldn't recommend using Murena e/OS or other alternatives that don't provide significant privacy and security benefits. However, even with Android forks, we'd still be relying on Google. Therefore, I'm hoping that Linux phones will become more usable in the future.
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It costs a missed opportunity to give more appropriate advice: stay away from google and use more private community forks of android that if I understand correctly will not be affected by googles papers please app ecosystem.
A strategy focusing on begging tech giants to not do the will of capital is basically lying to the public that there is a chance this can work.
In theory yes the open letter is a nice thing to have regardless of how google reacts because then we have something to point to how google is ignoring public opinion - but it needs to be presented with heavy caveats and we need to focus on getting average people out of googles grip so they don't hold this much power over us
Oh! We agree. That's what @plasmamobile is all about. However, realistically PlaMo is not ready for the general public yet, despite how hard we are working on it.
If we could get the sort of support regular Plasma has, the story would be VERY different. But PlaMo is still niche.
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@ambiguous_yelp @olivenolje @kde One issue with using custom ROMs is device availability. I wanted to use an alternative OS instead of stock Android, but most devices supported by CalyxOS (which is currently on hold) and LineageOS are no longer available for purchase in my country. The ideal option would be to buy a Google Pixel and use GrapheneOS, but unfortunately, it's not available in my country either. I wouldn't recommend using Murena e/OS or other alternatives that don't provide significant privacy and security benefits. However, even with Android forks, we'd still be relying on Google. Therefore, I'm hoping that Linux phones will become more usable in the future.
@helloclippy Device availability is definitely a friction point, but when choosing a new device this should be a priority and I will defend that, for example fairphone which is modular and pays workers a fairer wage and minimises conflict materials is compatible with /e/os
I would say that /e/os would still be better than using googles android because at least you can do away with Google Play Services (the component granting google the power to censor apps) and it can probably be hardened post-install too.
I'm not saying everyone needs to get a new phone right now but the existence of friction points doesn't mean we are powerless and it doesn't mean the friction can't be reduced in time
As an anarchist basically I don't think we should rely on undemocratic institutions to solve our problems we should do everything we can right now at a grassroots level
#FLOSS #Android #KeepAndroidOpen #Google #Fairphone #EOs #Censorship
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@ambiguous_yelp @olivenolje @kde One issue with using custom ROMs is device availability. I wanted to use an alternative OS instead of stock Android, but most devices supported by CalyxOS (which is currently on hold) and LineageOS are no longer available for purchase in my country. The ideal option would be to buy a Google Pixel and use GrapheneOS, but unfortunately, it's not available in my country either. I wouldn't recommend using Murena e/OS or other alternatives that don't provide significant privacy and security benefits. However, even with Android forks, we'd still be relying on Google. Therefore, I'm hoping that Linux phones will become more usable in the future.
@helloclippy @ambiguous_yelp @kde Clearly a big issue with android forks.
Therefore I clearly agree that we need better open hardware devices and open source firmware and software.
A couple of projects are aiming at achieving exactly that (Linux phones, Pinenote), but they are far away from being a solid/daily-drive alternative to Android/iPhones, just think banking apps.
The issue is time though, as open projects take a lot of it, while big tech solutions are rolled out on a conveyor belt...
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Oh! We agree. That's what @plasmamobile is all about. However, realistically PlaMo is not ready for the general public yet, despite how hard we are working on it.
If we could get the sort of support regular Plasma has, the story would be VERY different. But PlaMo is still niche.
@kde @olivenolje @plasmamobile
I hadn't heard until Plasma Mobile until now, I had only heard of the pinephone one. I am excited to hear more about the project development in the future!
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Oh! We agree. That's what @plasmamobile is all about. However, realistically PlaMo is not ready for the general public yet, despite how hard we are working on it.
If we could get the sort of support regular Plasma has, the story would be VERY different. But PlaMo is still niche.
@kde @ambiguous_yelp @plasmamobile Would more donations significantly help the project?
Or is the limiting factor the lack of contributors? -
@helloclippy @ambiguous_yelp @kde Clearly a big issue with android forks.
Therefore I clearly agree that we need better open hardware devices and open source firmware and software.
A couple of projects are aiming at achieving exactly that (Linux phones, Pinenote), but they are far away from being a solid/daily-drive alternative to Android/iPhones, just think banking apps.
The issue is time though, as open projects take a lot of it, while big tech solutions are rolled out on a conveyor belt...
A lot of the time banking apps are just QoL features though, obviously ymmv especially globally, but in my experience you can get by using the bank website, debit card details and cash. Those who can live without banking apps in order to grow the linux mobile ecosystem: should do so
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@kilgoretrout @kde @fdroidorg @keepandroidopen Don't expect to win a fight against a supertank if your only weapon is a fistful of tiny stones.
@Stem @kilgoretrout @kde @fdroidorg @keepandroidopen This mentality is exactly what brought us to this exact point in the first place. It's also what led to many major historical disasters (will do as I lack a better world rn)
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@simondeutschl @kde @fdroidorg @keepandroidopen Any option will lead to the same result, so what does it matter?
@Stem
If you fight, you'll probably lose. But if you don't fight, you have already lost. -
A lot of the time banking apps are just QoL features though, obviously ymmv especially globally, but in my experience you can get by using the bank website, debit card details and cash. Those who can live without banking apps in order to grow the linux mobile ecosystem: should do so
@ambiguous_yelp @helloclippy @kde You're right, I'd like to persuade myself to use cash again.
But the country I stay in rn is almost entirely running on DC, cash is a relic of long forgotten past.
But then again, in the EU, a new initiative (Wero) is growing, aiming at breaking free from Mastercard and Visa. Perhaps it is the "dreamt" opportunity to make a change towards a better digital payment system. But I am digressing
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KDE supports the "Keep Android Open" campaign
#Google will cut off independent developers to #Android if they do not register with Google first. This will kill independent platforms like @fdroidorg and severely impede FLOSS devs from creating apps for Android.
Keep Android Open
Advocating for Android as a free, open platform for everyone to build apps on.
(keepandroidopen.org)
Many KDE apps are deployed for Android: KDE Connect, Itinerary, Tokodon, and there's even a test version of Krita for Android.
KDE calls on Google to reverse course and @keepandroidopen.
An Open Letter to Google regarding Mandatory Developer Registration for Android App Distribution
Open Letter to Google Regarding Mandatory Developer Registration for Third-Party App Distribution
(keepandroidopen.org)
@kde @fdroidorg @keepandroidopen Don't let Android devices become a closed operating system, I strongly oppose it!
