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[nocto@social.lol]

@MostlyHarmless isn’t this basically what a tax free personal allowance is for? Though I’m not at all sure that the UK’s £12.5k, which feels like it’s been frozen forever, is enough for each person to pay for housing & utilities, but I feel like that’s the concept behind it.

[wifiwits@infosec.exchange]

@guteIT @babaq @MostlyHarmless for people earning below the income tax bracket this would undoubtedly lead to increased rates of vat which means they’d be hit very very hard.

[alper@sfba.social]

@birkenator @babaq @MostlyHarmless
That's not the part that matters most. (They borrow to avoid income). That lower income people spend all their income to make it through the month. Rich people spend a fraction of their income. If you can't tax them for the money they make they'll sit on more and more money.

[birkenator@mastodon.social]

@catch56 @alper @babaq @MostlyHarmless so in essence it’s easy to get around income tax and harder to get around VAT.

[babaq@mastodonczech.cz]

@alper I am not proposing to have *only* VAT – I suppose that some kind of revamped wealth tax is also necessary
@birkenator @MostlyHarmless

[xchaos@f.cz]

@MostlyHarmless yes, this idea is called "small business". Some people actually (but then, at least in EU, you soon qualify for VAT, which makes your products and services more expensive to everyone not paying VAT)

[gokushrm@mastodon.social]

@MostlyHarmless replace all income tax with service tax (whatever u buy or use). By doing this sale will increase dramatically and gov. ll get revenue from goods.

[jotho@mastodon.social]

@MostlyHarmless that's mostly BS. A rich person could run up fabulous bills for private airplanes, yachts, personal whatevers, his business, and never pay taxes at all. That's pretty much what already happens

[babaq@mastodonczech.cz]

@Landa it is too easy to evade income tax here in Czechia and I mainly reflect my experience
@elCelio @MostlyHarmless

[birkenator@mastodon.social]

@babaq @alper @MostlyHarmless it’s a pipe dream though.

Most western systems are all about keeping the lower classes occupied and uninformed while the higher classes make the real policy.

The key word is occupied - enough income for food and the occasional new car, but not enough to do damage.

That system is hard to change. In some places politics are almost Chinese, but rich people are hand picking politicians instead of an aligned committee.

[drorbedrack@mastodon.social]

@MostlyHarmless This is why we have tax breaks and brackets

[moises_pinto_muyal@mastodon.social]

@MostlyHarmless

That sounds logic!

[trillicit@social.vivaldi.net]

@MostlyHarmless

[jmcs@social.jsantos.eu]

@MostlyHarmless sales taxes and VAT are tied to revenue (even though in the case of VAT it's paid by the customer on paper the end effect is the same)

[thierry_van_kerm@mastodon.social]

@MostlyHarmless It makes sense. To me, corporate taxes should be considered as the contribution of the services businesses take advantage of, just as any other services they pay for.

[ahltorp@mastodon.nu]

@jmcs @MostlyHarmless VAT is, as can be inferred from its name, based on value add, not revenue. Incoming minus outgoing.

[jmcs@social.jsantos.eu]

@ahltorp @MostlyHarmless in most countries you can also deduct expenses you have with your work from the income tax.

[passwordsarehard4@mastodon.social]

@babaq @Landa @elCelio @MostlyHarmless they won’t pay any tax. If you tax purchases they just won’t buy anything. For real, they’ll just lease everything through an LLC that loses money each year and gets folded and replaced with another so it never has an operating profit.

[passwordsarehard4@mastodon.social]

@janneke @babaq @MostlyHarmless if you became disabled youd lose your house in a matter of years. It’s where most people’s wealth is stored, it’s your most valuable asset. Retires would be hit hard as well. If you carve an exemption for homes youd get mega mansions by the rich to avoid taxes again. They’d buy up entire counties with sprawling complex’s. It’s going to take effort.

[passwordsarehard4@mastodon.social]

@nocto @MostlyHarmless US federal taxes have a standardized deduction which I think works similar. They’d assume you would spend at least $X to stay alive so you can take that without any proof, no receipts or records needed. It brings down your taxable income by whatever amount and you pay tax on what’s left above that amount. It’s a scaling system it’s just a broken one.