We gotta fight back.
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We gotta fight back.
Contacting other open source projects and asking them to (hopefully) adopt a no-AI policy is a good first step, but we need to go further.
We need to make it harder for users to use AI with our content, and we need to make it harder for these companies to steal our shit.
I'm working on a tool, called cyanide, in order to poison LLMs at inference-level so they're absolutely useless when told to summarise content from a given website.
I encourage you to do the same. figure out ways to poison and otherwise break LLMs when they deal with your content. At inference level, at training level, it doesn't matter.
The more people do this, the more diverse tooling we build to stop these AI bro fucks from stealing our shit, the harder it is for the AI companies to clean up our shit, and the more obvious the failures and shortcomings of LLMs as search engines become for the average user.
Here are a couple resources I found helpful when researching LLM security topics:
- promptfoo.dev, a database of LLM vulnerabilities with links to research papers, which models are affected, etc.
- [google scholar, since these things are an active field of research](scholar.google.com)
- [openrouter.ai, cheap easy testing, especially when tested against multiple models since it's one simple API](openrouter.ai)
feel free to ping me for resources to add, and other tooling to break LLMs with the data they scrape, parse or train on itself (so while iocaine is cool and helpful, it doesn't really poison inputdata itself, it feeds different data depending on who accesses the page) -
We gotta fight back.
Contacting other open source projects and asking them to (hopefully) adopt a no-AI policy is a good first step, but we need to go further.
We need to make it harder for users to use AI with our content, and we need to make it harder for these companies to steal our shit.
I'm working on a tool, called cyanide, in order to poison LLMs at inference-level so they're absolutely useless when told to summarise content from a given website.
I encourage you to do the same. figure out ways to poison and otherwise break LLMs when they deal with your content. At inference level, at training level, it doesn't matter.
The more people do this, the more diverse tooling we build to stop these AI bro fucks from stealing our shit, the harder it is for the AI companies to clean up our shit, and the more obvious the failures and shortcomings of LLMs as search engines become for the average user.
Here are a couple resources I found helpful when researching LLM security topics:
- promptfoo.dev, a database of LLM vulnerabilities with links to research papers, which models are affected, etc.
- [google scholar, since these things are an active field of research](scholar.google.com)
- [openrouter.ai, cheap easy testing, especially when tested against multiple models since it's one simple API](openrouter.ai)
feel free to ping me for resources to add, and other tooling to break LLMs with the data they scrape, parse or train on itself (so while iocaine is cool and helpful, it doesn't really poison inputdata itself, it feeds different data depending on who accesses the page)@lucy you a literally act like a dog trying to chop off random car bumpers.
Its idiotic to use LLMs like they used 80% of times now, but LLM used quietly in many places make security, analysis, object recognition etc.
Why not adopt it correctly?
Attacking the trains again? -
@lucy you a literally act like a dog trying to chop off random car bumpers.
Its idiotic to use LLMs like they used 80% of times now, but LLM used quietly in many places make security, analysis, object recognition etc.
Why not adopt it correctly?
Attacking the trains again?@meowmashine
i would give zero fucks about LLMs if it wouldn't be built using shit they stole from us, and if they didn't ruin the environment in the process.
As for the "acting like a dog trying to chomp off random car bumpers": you missed the point. If anything, it's more akin to installing proper locks at ones door, so those fucks have a harder time stealing our shit.
These companies are not entitled to our shit. Period.
Our data is ours, and we can do whatever the fuck we want with it. If they wanna train their LLM on it, they can ask us nicely, and/or respect the license our shit is under.
Until then, we need to make sure they can't just take our shit, because apparently, they never heard of the concept "consent". -
@meowmashine
i would give zero fucks about LLMs if it wouldn't be built using shit they stole from us, and if they didn't ruin the environment in the process.
As for the "acting like a dog trying to chomp off random car bumpers": you missed the point. If anything, it's more akin to installing proper locks at ones door, so those fucks have a harder time stealing our shit.
These companies are not entitled to our shit. Period.
Our data is ours, and we can do whatever the fuck we want with it. If they wanna train their LLM on it, they can ask us nicely, and/or respect the license our shit is under.
Until then, we need to make sure they can't just take our shit, because apparently, they never heard of the concept "consent".@lucy oups, sorry...
But still, why? Open source is build for people to fix and use, but not for people with ai interface?
Personally I want the world to use and work with my software, update and fix it (then I finally can fucking retire) in any way possible.
If ai will learn from my code to create code that runs like clockwork in bad conditions, I am in.
I don't really think that licenses really work, if source is open, people or companies just gonna steal shit.Then, if we poison everything, we will kill things that really make a difference in the world. YOLA for example.(its visual neural network, but you got the point)
Another example:
Parse all source code and find how tun adapter is implemented (RAG), fast way to find the piece of code in big project to check security. It dies too
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@lucy oups, sorry...
But still, why? Open source is build for people to fix and use, but not for people with ai interface?
Personally I want the world to use and work with my software, update and fix it (then I finally can fucking retire) in any way possible.
If ai will learn from my code to create code that runs like clockwork in bad conditions, I am in.
I don't really think that licenses really work, if source is open, people or companies just gonna steal shit.Then, if we poison everything, we will kill things that really make a difference in the world. YOLA for example.(its visual neural network, but you got the point)
Another example:
Parse all source code and find how tun adapter is implemented (RAG), fast way to find the piece of code in big project to check security. It dies too@meowmashine bruhBut still, why?
are you really asking me why i don't wanna get stolen from? really? i don't think i don't have to explain, do I?Personally I want the world to use and work with my software, update and fix it [...] in any way possible.
My main focus right now with the AI poison-pilling isn't code, it's text, e.g. for a personal website.
Personally, I want to be a world where we avoid destroying the world just for a little bit of perceived (but disproven) convenience.I don't really think that licenses really work, if source is open, people or companies just gonna steal shit.
Maybe you should research legal cases against companies who breached licenses.If ai will learn from my code to create code that runs like clockwork in bad conditions, I am in.
AI-generated code is provably unreliable, terrible to maintain, riddled with security holes and LLMs poison our air and boil our oceans while generating it. It has been proven that LLMs don't make you more productive, they make you less productive.
Besides, you are aware that LLMs are just stochastic word-guessers, right? -
@meowmashine bruh
But still, why?
are you really asking me why i don't wanna get stolen from? really? i don't think i don't have to explain, do I?Personally I want the world to use and work with my software, update and fix it [...] in any way possible.
My main focus right now with the AI poison-pilling isn't code, it's text, e.g. for a personal website.
Personally, I want to be a world where we avoid destroying the world just for a little bit of perceived (but disproven) convenience.I don't really think that licenses really work, if source is open, people or companies just gonna steal shit.
Maybe you should research legal cases against companies who breached licenses.If ai will learn from my code to create code that runs like clockwork in bad conditions, I am in.
AI-generated code is provably unreliable, terrible to maintain, riddled with security holes and LLMs poison our air and boil our oceans while generating it. It has been proven that LLMs don't make you more productive, they make you less productive.
Besides, you are aware that LLMs are just stochastic word-guessers, right?@lucy
> are you really asking me why i don't wanna getstolen from? really?
You wouldnt_steal_a_car.jpg
Seriously? So you give out sources, but sometimes not :/? Its open or closed> My main focus right now with the AI poison-pilling isn't code, it's text, e.g. for a personal website.
So,
A: ai grabs your useless rant, and it's just dissapears in huge matrix, to never be seen again
B: ai just dies and rant is never seen again> Personally, I want to be a world where we avoid destroying the world just for a little bit of perceived (but disproven) convenience.
LLM can analyze if channel is filled with bot ads or just people trying to sell stuff.
Only YOLA can see people reliably, haar cascade is too unreliable.
Only LLM can talk with human, giving at least somewhat pleasing experience, and with external and filtered instruments can fix issues. (Techinal support did right, but noone did it right)
Code LLM can create multiple GUI,s fixes, a lot of boring GUI lib stuff, and then you can choose the best. (Noone will do this really, everyone hates to work on interfaces)> Maybe you should research legal cases against companies who breached licenses.
Throw the rock at me, I saw it multiple times in different organizations, noone will disassemble code of weird power box controller, and noone will disassemble code of private things that will never see the light.
> AI-generated code is provably unreliable, terrible to maintain, riddled with security holes and LLMs poison our air and boil our oceans while generating it. It has been proven that LLMs don't make you more productive, they make you less productive.
If you can't screw in a screw with a screwdriver, maybe it's a nail and you're doing some weird shit. The problem isn't the screwdriver. Remember the YOLA example? There is no way to make it more productive, or make it work at least
> Besides, you are aware that LLMs are just stochastic word-guessers, right?
Word guessers are good enough
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@lucy
> are you really asking me why i don't wanna getstolen from? really?
You wouldnt_steal_a_car.jpg
Seriously? So you give out sources, but sometimes not :/? Its open or closed> My main focus right now with the AI poison-pilling isn't code, it's text, e.g. for a personal website.
So,
A: ai grabs your useless rant, and it's just dissapears in huge matrix, to never be seen again
B: ai just dies and rant is never seen again> Personally, I want to be a world where we avoid destroying the world just for a little bit of perceived (but disproven) convenience.
LLM can analyze if channel is filled with bot ads or just people trying to sell stuff.
Only YOLA can see people reliably, haar cascade is too unreliable.
Only LLM can talk with human, giving at least somewhat pleasing experience, and with external and filtered instruments can fix issues. (Techinal support did right, but noone did it right)
Code LLM can create multiple GUI,s fixes, a lot of boring GUI lib stuff, and then you can choose the best. (Noone will do this really, everyone hates to work on interfaces)> Maybe you should research legal cases against companies who breached licenses.
Throw the rock at me, I saw it multiple times in different organizations, noone will disassemble code of weird power box controller, and noone will disassemble code of private things that will never see the light.
> AI-generated code is provably unreliable, terrible to maintain, riddled with security holes and LLMs poison our air and boil our oceans while generating it. It has been proven that LLMs don't make you more productive, they make you less productive.
If you can't screw in a screw with a screwdriver, maybe it's a nail and you're doing some weird shit. The problem isn't the screwdriver. Remember the YOLA example? There is no way to make it more productive, or make it work at least
> Besides, you are aware that LLMs are just stochastic word-guessers, right?
Word guessers are good enough
@lucy I think this is just problem bot problem but with extra steps. Captchas, geoblocks... But now it just more complicated
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@lucy
> are you really asking me why i don't wanna getstolen from? really?
You wouldnt_steal_a_car.jpg
Seriously? So you give out sources, but sometimes not :/? Its open or closed> My main focus right now with the AI poison-pilling isn't code, it's text, e.g. for a personal website.
So,
A: ai grabs your useless rant, and it's just dissapears in huge matrix, to never be seen again
B: ai just dies and rant is never seen again> Personally, I want to be a world where we avoid destroying the world just for a little bit of perceived (but disproven) convenience.
LLM can analyze if channel is filled with bot ads or just people trying to sell stuff.
Only YOLA can see people reliably, haar cascade is too unreliable.
Only LLM can talk with human, giving at least somewhat pleasing experience, and with external and filtered instruments can fix issues. (Techinal support did right, but noone did it right)
Code LLM can create multiple GUI,s fixes, a lot of boring GUI lib stuff, and then you can choose the best. (Noone will do this really, everyone hates to work on interfaces)> Maybe you should research legal cases against companies who breached licenses.
Throw the rock at me, I saw it multiple times in different organizations, noone will disassemble code of weird power box controller, and noone will disassemble code of private things that will never see the light.
> AI-generated code is provably unreliable, terrible to maintain, riddled with security holes and LLMs poison our air and boil our oceans while generating it. It has been proven that LLMs don't make you more productive, they make you less productive.
If you can't screw in a screw with a screwdriver, maybe it's a nail and you're doing some weird shit. The problem isn't the screwdriver. Remember the YOLA example? There is no way to make it more productive, or make it work at least
> Besides, you are aware that LLMs are just stochastic word-guessers, right?
Word guessers are good enough
@meowmashine have fun with your stochastic labubu. I'm not trying to convince you to not use it.
I'm trying to prevent you from giving it my data, because that's not your choice to make. And i encourage everyone who also doesn't want you to give it their data to do the same.
Also, comparing AI companies stealing private peoples shit with pirating media from huge ass conglomerates is disingenuous as fuck. Don't bullshit me, buddy. You know it's bs just as much as I do, and that's not gonna work with me.
I think this conversation should end now. I don't accept the premise of assholes. -
@lucy you a literally act like a dog trying to chop off random car bumpers.
Its idiotic to use LLMs like they used 80% of times now, but LLM used quietly in many places make security, analysis, object recognition etc.
Why not adopt it correctly?
Attacking the trains again?@meowmashine @lucy LLMs have had basically zero usage beyond translation (which already worked fine pre-gpt) and generating copious amounts of bullshit online, from clickbait articles, to fake medical advice that puts people in danger, to auto-generated youtube slop
attacking LLMs is a net gain for humanity, the rest of machine learning is cool and i hope it keeps growing, specially the ones that allow us so study the world a bit better
