tip: web requests should not be measured in Hz [hertz] as that is only used for periodic frequencies, which random events (like requests hitting a web server) are not!
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@moof was the "something's wrong," sound a dying crow or something. terrible sqwawking. good use of alternative monitoring modes though *smile*
@bigpawedbear Generally I think it was a change in the pattern of birdsong. Every email was a chirp or tweet. If you had a whole burst of emails all of a sudden, you would hear it as a cacophony. If you heard a lot more, say, crows than, say, bluejays, that could be indicative of a larger number of MIME-encoded emails over a certain size, and the general mix of sounds would sound a little… off. That should be enough to start looking at monitoring and logs
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@bigpawedbear Generally I think it was a change in the pattern of birdsong. Every email was a chirp or tweet. If you had a whole burst of emails all of a sudden, you would hear it as a cacophony. If you heard a lot more, say, crows than, say, bluejays, that could be indicative of a larger number of MIME-encoded emails over a certain size, and the general mix of sounds would sound a little… off. That should be enough to start looking at monitoring and logs
@moof ah, so if you suddenly had a murder of crows, it would be signs that something was aflap *smile*
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@sophie and use clicks to indicate each one!
geiger counter here we gooo!! -
@4censord @sophie I remember talking to someone in the late 90s, early 00s that told me a colleague had tied in a sound generator to their company’s smtp servers, and it would play forest sounds in the background all day in the sysadmin office. I seem to recall that the amount of rain was tied to the load, and different bird calls represented different types and sizes of mail.
It was done in such a way as to be a pleasant background sound, but at the same time, when something went wrong, the sysops would hear it long before monitoring flagged it.
I suspect this system eventually died a death due to moving to a cloud provider, but it does show that monitoring can be something other than visual…
Nuclear power stations have a criticality alarm which sounds all the time, it's when it stops that there is a problem and you really don't want to be there.
It is apparently more jarring when it stops compared to starting a new sound.
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@moof @4censord @sophie A friend of mine showed me the idea ages ago: https://pestilenz.org/~bauerm/shoestring/2004/06/30#netsound
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@4censord @sophie I remember talking to someone in the late 90s, early 00s that told me a colleague had tied in a sound generator to their company’s smtp servers, and it would play forest sounds in the background all day in the sysadmin office. I seem to recall that the amount of rain was tied to the load, and different bird calls represented different types and sizes of mail.
It was done in such a way as to be a pleasant background sound, but at the same time, when something went wrong, the sysops would hear it long before monitoring flagged it.
I suspect this system eventually died a death due to moving to a cloud provider, but it does show that monitoring can be something other than visual…
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As far as I know, this is not true. What is true is that the Trino Vercellese nuclear power station in Italy had acoustic transducers (basically microphones) mounted at several important points in the primary circuit, with the sound being piped to speakers in the control room, and after a few months the operators found that they could infer the state of the plant more quickly and reliably from that sound than from the instruments and gages. It makes the sound effects in STAR TREK (1966) suddenly seem a lot more reasonable.
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As far as I know, this is not true. What is true is that the Trino Vercellese nuclear power station in Italy had acoustic transducers (basically microphones) mounted at several important points in the primary circuit, with the sound being piped to speakers in the control room, and after a few months the operators found that they could infer the state of the plant more quickly and reliably from that sound than from the instruments and gages. It makes the sound effects in STAR TREK (1966) suddenly seem a lot more reasonable.
@tsukkitsune @moof @4censord @sophie
It may not be still in use, but it definitely used to exist at UK sites that handle waste e.g. Sellafield.
But as pointed out here the continuous regular was more to show the alarm was still working.
Did U.K. nuclear power plants of the '80s play a continuous sound and indicate emergency by stopping it?
Allan Friswell's comment (scroll down) on this video for "O Superman" for Laurie Anderson contends: The UK nuclear power stations of the 80s had that "ha" sound on continuously 24/7. Apparently i...
Skeptics Stack Exchange (skeptics.stackexchange.com)
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As far as I know, this is not true. What is true is that the Trino Vercellese nuclear power station in Italy had acoustic transducers (basically microphones) mounted at several important points in the primary circuit, with the sound being piped to speakers in the control room, and after a few months the operators found that they could infer the state of the plant more quickly and reliably from that sound than from the instruments and gages. It makes the sound effects in STAR TREK (1966) suddenly seem a lot more reasonable.
@tsukkitsune @ben @moof @4censord @sophie
It's not currently nuclear power stations, but it is true that the Urenco nuclear fuel processing plant at Capenhurst in Cheshire has a regular rhythmic sound that's always sounding to indicate that everything is okay. https://www.thetimes.com/sunday-times-100-tech/hardware-profile/article/uranium-firm-finds-path-to-enrichment-jl7bbp88xw3 - archived here https://archive.ph/2nK2H
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@lain_7 @moof @4censord @sophie
Using
s=0.59cas the signal propagation rate of copper,Δt=10°C, and17.6ppm/°Cas the coefficient of expansion of copper, a 1km transmission line would see an additional 1ns delay when heated. (100ns for 100km and so on)So clearly with plenty of wire and a dedicated measurement setup you could measure it.
(I was unable to find whether there's a temperature dependence to signal propagation rate in copper conductor nor do I have a good intuition as to why there should or shouldn't be. however this paper reviews two additional temperature-dependent factors:
https://www.haystack.mit.edu/wp-content/uploads/2020/07/memo_mark-5_067.pdf
such as phase delay due to changes in impedance)Measuring it incidentally using network traffic seems harder. On less than 10m of cable (& 1 intervening network switch) my ping time standard deviation is 31us on 1000 packets. You'd need many measurements (and a very stable local timebase, not just a standard crystal oscillator) to find a nanosecond-level variation in transmission time through statistics on ping times. would love to hear more about whether & how this has actually been measured!
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R relay@relay.infosec.exchange shared this topic
