I deactivated Google Play on my phone.
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@CiaraNi good job! PWA or desktop site!
No one should have ever gotten comfortable with “app stores,” not that we were given much choice. I remember jailbreaking iPhone 3GS. That gave me more features and control of the device than any we have today. The API restrictions of vanilla iOS and Android allow such insane abuse of the customer by the OEMs and telecom providers, locking you out of something you own.
(Looks like iPhone #jailbreak is still a thing but just barely…
.)@andrew Thank you for introducing me to 'PWA'. I looked it up. I have been wondering what to call the apps I have been switching to. I've been muttering about BigTech and non-BigTech apps, now I now that 'Progressive Web Apps' is the term for the stand-alone ones that aren't locked in to Big Tech.
And yes, agreed, we should never have got comfortable with the 'app stores' and a lot of other digital stuff we got entangled in. At least awareness of this is growing now.
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@raymaccarthy @weezmgk Agreed.
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@CiaraNi The google tie in is really annoying. The electric company also might find them self in problems with Alphabet in the future.
@jonfr600 The way the US and the BigTech companies are going right now, it's hard to know what could happen. A lot of companies and institutions are going to be in great difficulty if they don't move off the US solutions before something goes even more royally wrong.
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@CiaraNi So frustrating. "How did people do anything before iPhones and Androids?" They made it work. Websites, branch offices, mail-ins, what have you.
Except all those types of business presence got nuked once "just download our shitty app" became the cheap default.
It's never been a sensible choice to be so dependent on smartphones let alone 2 private OS vendors in 1 unstable country.
@AzureArmageddon Exactly right. Agreed to all of this. It sneaked up slowly on a lot of us. We got more and more entangled for years before we realised there was anything wrong. Doctorow's three stages of enshittification describe it perfectly. No wonder it's not easy to 'just leave'. It takes time and effort.
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RE: https://mastodon.nu/@suddigare/116194365649110453
@CiaraNi Some people from Sweden got inspired and has startede something.
@asbjornn Hvor fedt! Flot gået af dem. Danmark, Tyskland, Sverige - det vokser! Tak fordi du delte.
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@sindum Det er et fremragende idé. Noget til digitale produkter a la Svanemærket eller Ø, der ved ét blik fortæller, at det er en platform-uafhængig løsning. Nu sidder jeg og spekulerer over, hvad det kunne hedde. Er blank lige nu, jeg tænker videre. Og måske har andre gode forslag.
@CiaraNi
The software sovereignty scale -
@CiaraNi
The software sovereignty scale@notsoloud @sindum God idé!
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I deactivated Google Play on my phone. The electricity company app was the first to be bricked. 'You must update.'
I wrote to them: ’I don’t have Google or Apple. Where else can I update the app?’ Nowhere else, they replied.
I wrote (politely) back: ’I can’t use your app any more then. It’s an odd requirement to make of your customers. A Norlys customer can only access all Norlys services if they are also a customer of one of two specific private for-profit US companies.’
@CiaraNi aurora store?
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@CiaraNi aurora store?
@lefteristrip23 Thanks for the suggestion. I looked that up and it's a Google Play workaround. And I'd have to reactivate my Google Play app and log in to it in order to set up Aurora. It's a fine idea. In the specific case, I'll choose just not to use their app any more also on principle because they are locking their own customers in to a third-party company.
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@CiaraNi More and more companies are moving away from web interface in favour of Apple and Google, forcing everyone into that a d preventing users from choices. These include essentials services like banks and utilities which are not right.
@mukto_manob Agreed. It's particularly problematic when it's essential services doing this, as you say. I've walked away from things like Spotify and Outlook mail, but I can't walk away from an essential service like the electricity company. All I can do is delete the app and write to them to let them know why.
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@CiaraNi Fighting the good fight sister!
@ridethewildrover You are kind
It's the teeny-tiniest thing to do, but the communal effort to switch from Big Tech has motivated me to at least do thsi much - to write to companies and institutions, to let them know. -
@CiaraNi Præcis. Altså hvis de alligevel vælger at tilbyde folk med "rigtige computere" den samme oplevelse på en web, så slår de jo alle fluer med et smæk.
Når man vælger at lave en app, skal man pludselig forholde sig yderligere to ret specielle platforme, særlige app-store betingelser, et hav af forskellige telefoner og tablets. Det er meget mere komplekst.
Og, lyder det som, i dit tilfælde burde det være unødvendigt.
Hvad gør du så? Logger på Google, opdaterer, logger af igen?
@oldrup Der var to valg. At give efter, logge på Google Play og opdatere. Eller at logge ud af Norlys-appen og afinstalle den. Det var et nemt valg. Jeg har fjernet Norlys-appen. Jeg kan bruge websiden fra min PC når jeg er hjemme og har min kodeviser i nærheden.
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@leberschnitzel Good luck! I have started writing to companies to object to customer-unfriendly use of AI or services that are locked in to third-party Big Tech companies. I feel foolish, one small customer, but if enough of us do it, maybe they'll hear the collective voice.
It's NOT foolish. Rosa Parks was but one and certainly NOT foolish.
Sure, that was an entirely different and arguably much more important "topic", but everything each and every one of us does MATTERS.
YOU MATTER.
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@ThePolishDispatch @CiaraNi
Revolut can't be used without an App.
An Post Banking has limited counter services without the App.
But PayPal and my Credit card work 100% on the website without an App. Both keep advertising the App, which I have never installed.
Also the daft Credit Card people think adding my account to Google Wallet and adding NFC is more secure.
I only use the CC online & the card lives at home. NFC is disabled. I have no intention of using Google pay/wallet. Or having Apple.@ThePolishDispatch @CiaraNi
Obviously using Revolut to purchase without an app works (virtual card online and optional plastic card for physical shopping. But the App is needed to create the account and manage it or make a payment via IBAN. -
@ThePolishDispatch @CiaraNi
Obviously using Revolut to purchase without an app works (virtual card online and optional plastic card for physical shopping. But the App is needed to create the account and manage it or make a payment via IBAN.@raymaccarthy @ThePolishDispatch I'm at the Cranky With Big Tech stage where I won't even use a new app to start something and then delete it after setting up. It's time-consuming enough getting away from the ones I already have.
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@agturcz @CiaraNi @Gina there is https://www.appdwang.nl/ by @kevin.
At the same time, I haven't ran into a smartphone requirement myself yet in the Netherlands, either generally or blessed by Apple/Google. Such situation would create a problem as I would not have a suitable device.
Especially banks do appear notorious to try to push for this though.@jschwart @agturcz @CiaraNi @Gina I've also never faced a smartphone requirement myself, but admittedly I do go out of my way to avoid getting into situations where that might happen, and I'm also perfectly willing to not do things if they would require those devices, just like I simply walk by any store that says "PIN only".
So I guess I'm not the best example case here. Banks are indeed the most problematic, although I do have accounts at four Dutch banks that don't require Android or iOS.
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I deactivated Google Play on my phone. The electricity company app was the first to be bricked. 'You must update.'
I wrote to them: ’I don’t have Google or Apple. Where else can I update the app?’ Nowhere else, they replied.
I wrote (politely) back: ’I can’t use your app any more then. It’s an odd requirement to make of your customers. A Norlys customer can only access all Norlys services if they are also a customer of one of two specific private for-profit US companies.’
@CiaraNi As I am avid user of the non-googled 25yo phone for my daily talks I twice got asked "install app or else go away". They both (bank/telco) caved in when threatened with invoking EU anti-discrimintation laws and reporting them straight to the EC (It was before the 1499/1500 directives even, I was invoking 2019 one IIRC). I wonder whether Denmark anti-discrimination laws can be used to get at the google-happy company demandin customer in EU to use US-based services.
