With all the tiktok drama I have been telling people Mastodon is still here and kicking!!
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With all the tiktok drama I have been telling people Mastodon is still here and kicking!! I love this app and I really think the decentralized model is the best for social media.
Still, people don’t want to join! What do you think Mastodon’s biggest barriers are to courting new users? What could be done to improve the product and grow the user base in a positive way?
@taylorlorenz I moved to Mastodon because of the it’s decentralized model, but as a not overly technical person it’s not as easy to use. Some of the other platforms and a lot of friends are coasting on the other corporate platforms because they have their friend networks there.
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With all the tiktok drama I have been telling people Mastodon is still here and kicking!! I love this app and I really think the decentralized model is the best for social media.
Still, people don’t want to join! What do you think Mastodon’s biggest barriers are to courting new users? What could be done to improve the product and grow the user base in a positive way?
The first hurdle for a new user is deciding on what server to join, without knowing what that means or how to decide between them.
Second, they have to figure out who to follow and how to curate their feed to the point where it's rewarding, before losing interest.
Third, Mastodon doesn't have communities / groups, which is what a lot of users use especially Facebook for.
Fourth, the tools for discoverability are weak. Sure, there's /explore and hashtags, but not much else.
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@taylorlorenz Have you heard/read about the Forkiverse? The Mastodon server started by three popular podcasters that has grown to almost 10k members in just about two weeks.
I actually put together https://stefanbohacek.com/blog/fediverse-an-overview-for-community-organizers/ using it as a case study, hoping to maybe start reaching out to people who already have a following and could be interested in replicating this experiment.
@taylorlorenz Also, specifically for TikTok users, we actually do have a federated alternative, not sure if you heard of it, https://joinloops.org?
I wonder if Mastodon's reputation has been too tarnished by all the gatekeeping and scolding. Maybe we could get more people into the fediverse sneakily through another platform?
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With all the tiktok drama I have been telling people Mastodon is still here and kicking!! I love this app and I really think the decentralized model is the best for social media.
Still, people don’t want to join! What do you think Mastodon’s biggest barriers are to courting new users? What could be done to improve the product and grow the user base in a positive way?
@taylorlorenz for people subject to abuse (I'm not), I've seen requests for reply controls and support for shared blocklists.
You may know this, but Loops at @loops is a fediverse alternative to tiktok. It's pretty new but is developing quickly, from what I gather (I haven't used it).
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With all the tiktok drama I have been telling people Mastodon is still here and kicking!! I love this app and I really think the decentralized model is the best for social media.
Still, people don’t want to join! What do you think Mastodon’s biggest barriers are to courting new users? What could be done to improve the product and grow the user base in a positive way?
@taylorlorenz honestly? The chance of becoming a famous and/or wealthy internet influencer is much lower here. I think that is a big deterrent for people, whether they're willing to admit it or not.
As for what can be done about that? Nothing, really, because I think that's what makes it so appealing to the rest of us.
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With all the tiktok drama I have been telling people Mastodon is still here and kicking!! I love this app and I really think the decentralized model is the best for social media.
Still, people don’t want to join! What do you think Mastodon’s biggest barriers are to courting new users? What could be done to improve the product and grow the user base in a positive way?
@taylorlorenz
"What do you think Mastodon’s biggest barriers are to courting new users?"Their family & friends aren't here. Laziness to try something new. They don't know that the fedi exists.
"What could be done to improve the product and grow the user base in a positive way?"
The product ain't broke so don't brake it. I don't know if it's a positive pitch, but if big tech social media users loath billionaires, then they need to stop empowering them with their presence on their platforms.
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@taylorlorenz Have you heard/read about the Forkiverse? The Mastodon server started by three popular podcasters that has grown to almost 10k members in just about two weeks.
I actually put together https://stefanbohacek.com/blog/fediverse-an-overview-for-community-organizers/ using it as a case study, hoping to maybe start reaching out to people who already have a following and could be interested in replicating this experiment.
@stefan @taylorlorenz Yeah, I think that's it. People want (among other things) community, and having an entire community move here at once makes a lot more sense than having individuals try to build up a community. That's why, when I tried mastodon in 2019/2020, it never took off for me; but during the twitter implosion of 2022, when a bunch of my twitter-using friends moved here as well, I stuck around. The forkiverse is just the latest example of that.
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@taylorlorenz one thing, the decentralized nature means there is perhaps too much choice. Do you get an account on mastodon.social, mstdn.ca, mastodon.com, tusky.whatever.... And also what app do you use to access it? When there was Twitter, there was one official app. With Mastodon, there are a multitude. Sometimes too much choice is counterproductive.
You are reasoning against the constitution of the fediVerse and FOSS @hfinyow itself.
Dictatorship is way easier than a democracy, no elections, no choice, none of the troubles independence comes with ..
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With all the tiktok drama I have been telling people Mastodon is still here and kicking!! I love this app and I really think the decentralized model is the best for social media.
Still, people don’t want to join! What do you think Mastodon’s biggest barriers are to courting new users? What could be done to improve the product and grow the user base in a positive way?
I think the product is just fine. Wonderful, in fact. I'm glad that Taylor Lorenz and Corey Doctorow and George Takai and Lisa Melton etc, etc are the local celebrities on this site. I also think scarcity and "being cool" (in other words, not trying) are the ultimate signifier of where folks should want to be.
It ain't broken.
Let's not fix it.
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With all the tiktok drama I have been telling people Mastodon is still here and kicking!! I love this app and I really think the decentralized model is the best for social media.
Still, people don’t want to join! What do you think Mastodon’s biggest barriers are to courting new users? What could be done to improve the product and grow the user base in a positive way?
There really is a HOA here even if it's not fashionable to mention it. And there is a harassment problem that is made worse by no reply controls and the terrible, terrible misfeature of followers-only replies.
@taylorlorenz -
@NickGates
> Black users have consistently reported hostilityIs that still so @futurebird & @IveyJanette or is this a tale that persists because of events in the past?
The most important detail of the fedi is decentralization. Moderation problems increase with the size of instances. Communities protect themselves best by creating their own instances.
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With all the tiktok drama I have been telling people Mastodon is still here and kicking!! I love this app and I really think the decentralized model is the best for social media.
Still, people don’t want to join! What do you think Mastodon’s biggest barriers are to courting new users? What could be done to improve the product and grow the user base in a positive way?
@taylorlorenz I feel like the only way left is to set up huge armadas of influencer bots from the established social networks to draw people in and then delete them all once we've reached a certain threshold of network effect.
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With all the tiktok drama I have been telling people Mastodon is still here and kicking!! I love this app and I really think the decentralized model is the best for social media.
Still, people don’t want to join! What do you think Mastodon’s biggest barriers are to courting new users? What could be done to improve the product and grow the user base in a positive way?
@taylorlorenz Users of social media have been *deskilled* to the point where they expect a platform to essentially do everything for them: grab an app, put in your name, maybe tap some circles or something, and bang zoom, you get a feed.
The barrier is that Mastodon--and to a lesser extent Bluesky--are slightly less easy. Now, I'd argue that if you take five minutes to choose an instance that matches your tastes, it provides a feed right away, and then you can build your follow list, but...
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@taylorlorenz a lot I think comes down to good old FOMO: fear of missing out. At some point there will be a tipping point where individuals feel they can get the same amount of social content they seek, local to international, just from the social web. I can see it happening.
The slower we grow the bigger the chance we don't just morph into a copy of the asocial web out there.
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@taylorlorenz Users of social media have been *deskilled* to the point where they expect a platform to essentially do everything for them: grab an app, put in your name, maybe tap some circles or something, and bang zoom, you get a feed.
The barrier is that Mastodon--and to a lesser extent Bluesky--are slightly less easy. Now, I'd argue that if you take five minutes to choose an instance that matches your tastes, it provides a feed right away, and then you can build your follow list, but...
@taylorlorenz For a lot of people, "choose instance -> get feed -> build follow list" feels like it's in the wrong order. They're used to an algorithm "serving" them.
So. If the goal is to get new users onto the platform, then what you want to build is a gateway that says, "What are your interests?" and then new users put in three (let's say), and then it offers a few instances that match their interests, and they pick one. I think something like that would make them feel "served."
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@stefan @taylorlorenz Yeah, I think that's it. People want (among other things) community, and having an entire community move here at once makes a lot more sense than having individuals try to build up a community. That's why, when I tried mastodon in 2019/2020, it never took off for me; but during the twitter implosion of 2022, when a bunch of my twitter-using friends moved here as well, I stuck around. The forkiverse is just the latest example of that.
@Andres4NY Absolutely! It also helps with the choice paralysis of having to pick a server.
I think overall it just makes sense to promote communities rather than bog people down with technical details of how the fediverse works. (There's always time for that later.)
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The lack of an algorithm is the biggest advantage and the biggest disadvantage - it makes it hard to discover new content and people to follow. I know people are working on "starter packs" for Mastodon like they have on BlueSky, which I think will help.
But I wonder if we could find other ways to make discovery easier - a "followed by people you follow" or "favorited by people you follow" feed, or something. Also, I wonder if the interface shouldn't suggest boosting a post when you favorite it... We need more people boosting more stuff, with no algorithm.
You have to follow 200+ people to get a decently full feed on Mastodon, and everyone has to boost a lot. Reducing the effort required to do those things would increase engagement on Mastodon, I'm pretty sure.
People don't understand the basics of a federated system. To boost is to spread content across the network, not just to share it with your very own contacts.
It's crucial for the fedi!
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@taylorlorenz For a lot of people, "choose instance -> get feed -> build follow list" feels like it's in the wrong order. They're used to an algorithm "serving" them.
So. If the goal is to get new users onto the platform, then what you want to build is a gateway that says, "What are your interests?" and then new users put in three (let's say), and then it offers a few instances that match their interests, and they pick one. I think something like that would make them feel "served."
@taylorlorenz Also, one-button transfer of accounts from one instance to another. If it's not ultra-convenient then it's not really a feature.
That's assuming really do want Mastodon to get bigger. If what they actually want is for Mastodon to only be populated with people who "pass the test" of getting on Mastodon, then there's nothing to change. They don't want a gateway. They just want a gate.
IMO.
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@hfinyow @taylorlorenz at the same time, this isn't a problem with email. Everyone uses email and they're not tripped up by there being dozens of email service providers. The big problem is Mastodon resists commercialization by its nature so there's no giant corpo spending big bucks pushing the "one" canonical version that everyone flocks to
@jbd @hfinyow @taylorlorenz Counter to your counter: most people use one of, what, four different email services? Email hasn't been captured like social media was, but they're working on it.
I do agree, though. Mastodon is anti-commercial, and people are used to for-profit social media, which has its own structures. People are accustomed to that, and even if it's crap, it's what they know.
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I don't think this is the "biggest barrier" to reaching new users.
The biggest barriers are:
* Popular content creators who ought to care about building independent social media don't know it exists or why it's important. What if Emma from MR were here? For example.
* Sign up remains hard. I know why people don't want to integrate google auth... but if it were an option for some servers it'd make a big difference.
* UI needs more work.
