It's difficult for me to believe that three F-15s were shot down by friendly fire in two days.
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It's difficult for me to believe that three F-15s were shot down by friendly fire in two days.
It's much, much easier for me to believe that the American - and world's - military-industrial apparatus will say and do whatever it takes to keep the headlines from reading "$100,000,000 F-15 Strike Eagle Brought Down By $5,000 Drones."
@mhoye@cosocial.ca Why go for the lesser embarrasment? Given the levels of communication skills displayed in other areas, I think it's entirely possible three F-15s were shot down accidentally by friendly $5000 drones...
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It's difficult for me to believe that three F-15s were shot down by friendly fire in two days.
It's much, much easier for me to believe that the American - and world's - military-industrial apparatus will say and do whatever it takes to keep the headlines from reading "$100,000,000 F-15 Strike Eagle Brought Down By $5,000 Drones."
@mhoye
I wish it was hard to believe, but my history of contacts with the Canadian armed forces and their stories tell me it's 100% plausible. Americans are sloppy and friendly fire happens.I had a buddy come home from a computer networking exercise with the Americans with a friendly fire injury in his unit. Yup, went from "pulling cable for printers" to "shot by an American".
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It's difficult for me to believe that three F-15s were shot down by friendly fire in two days.
It's much, much easier for me to believe that the American - and world's - military-industrial apparatus will say and do whatever it takes to keep the headlines from reading "$100,000,000 F-15 Strike Eagle Brought Down By $5,000 Drones."
@mhoye Weapon-wielding Americans are usually so careful
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It's difficult for me to believe that three F-15s were shot down by friendly fire in two days.
It's much, much easier for me to believe that the American - and world's - military-industrial apparatus will say and do whatever it takes to keep the headlines from reading "$100,000,000 F-15 Strike Eagle Brought Down By $5,000 Drones."
@mhoye
It would be tragicomic, as IIRC Ukrainian infantry trains to shoot Shaheds with small arms (provided low enough attitude). -
It's difficult for me to believe that three F-15s were shot down by friendly fire in two days.
It's much, much easier for me to believe that the American - and world's - military-industrial apparatus will say and do whatever it takes to keep the headlines from reading "$100,000,000 F-15 Strike Eagle Brought Down By $5,000 Drones."
@mhoye
It would be tragicomic, as IIRC Ukrainian troops have instructions how to shoot Shaheds with small arms, provided low enough attitude. -
It's difficult for me to believe that three F-15s were shot down by friendly fire in two days.
It's much, much easier for me to believe that the American - and world's - military-industrial apparatus will say and do whatever it takes to keep the headlines from reading "$100,000,000 F-15 Strike Eagle Brought Down By $5,000 Drones."
@mhoye it sounds like it was a single incident, and given the general chaos - and mismatch between an F-15 and any drone available to Iran - I'd say it's a lot more believable, that a returning flight got tagged as hostile and shot down.
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@mhoye it sounds like it was a single incident, and given the general chaos - and mismatch between an F-15 and any drone available to Iran - I'd say it's a lot more believable, that a returning flight got tagged as hostile and shot down.
@heretohinder @mhoye This seems more likely as I'm guessing* the quality of military personal in these oil rich nations is not top tier.
*lets call it an educated guess
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It's difficult for me to believe that three F-15s were shot down by friendly fire in two days.
It's much, much easier for me to believe that the American - and world's - military-industrial apparatus will say and do whatever it takes to keep the headlines from reading "$100,000,000 F-15 Strike Eagle Brought Down By $5,000 Drones."
@mhoye We've already been practicing shooting down our own aircraft in the desert outside El Paso, so I expect we're pretty good at it by now.
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It's difficult for me to believe that three F-15s were shot down by friendly fire in two days.
It's much, much easier for me to believe that the American - and world's - military-industrial apparatus will say and do whatever it takes to keep the headlines from reading "$100,000,000 F-15 Strike Eagle Brought Down By $5,000 Drones."
@mhoye Or by the F-15's own inherent software flaws.
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It's difficult for me to believe that three F-15s were shot down by friendly fire in two days.
It's much, much easier for me to believe that the American - and world's - military-industrial apparatus will say and do whatever it takes to keep the headlines from reading "$100,000,000 F-15 Strike Eagle Brought Down By $5,000 Drones."
@mhoye it's not implausible, in fact it's even likely if the Kuwaiti air-defenses weren't integrated with the US IFF systems. In an environment saturated with targets people get trigger-happy. The Russians shot down a lot of their own planes over Ukraine for the same reason.
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@mhoye We've already been practicing shooting down our own aircraft in the desert outside El Paso, so I expect we're pretty good at it by now.
There's a systematic elimination of competence going on right now, it's pretty shocking.
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@heretohinder @mhoye This seems more likely as I'm guessing* the quality of military personal in these oil rich nations is not top tier.
*lets call it an educated guess
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It's difficult for me to believe that three F-15s were shot down by friendly fire in two days.
It's much, much easier for me to believe that the American - and world's - military-industrial apparatus will say and do whatever it takes to keep the headlines from reading "$100,000,000 F-15 Strike Eagle Brought Down By $5,000 Drones."
@mhoye Easy to believe IMO, especially given the report it was Kuwaiti SAMs who are likely not as well coordinated as US force would be. Both previous gulf wars had numerous friendly fire incidents, and they had fewer incoming air targets
As far as drones go, at least one of the F-15s was clearly hit be a missile. Could theoretically have been launched from a drone, but it'd have to be a pretty advanced, long range one to do it over Kuwait
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It's difficult for me to believe that three F-15s were shot down by friendly fire in two days.
It's much, much easier for me to believe that the American - and world's - military-industrial apparatus will say and do whatever it takes to keep the headlines from reading "$100,000,000 F-15 Strike Eagle Brought Down By $5,000 Drones."
@mhoye Exactly. Ukraine changed literally everything.
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@mhoye it's not implausible, in fact it's even likely if the Kuwaiti air-defenses weren't integrated with the US IFF systems. In an environment saturated with targets people get trigger-happy. The Russians shot down a lot of their own planes over Ukraine for the same reason.
@gabrielesvelto @mhoye If I remember what I vaguely heard from the Ukraine war when I was following it, the Russians also sometimes had to choose between turning on their electronic warfare systems to avoid Ukrainian stuff and not risking friendly fire. If you think about it, your own IFF system would be very convenient for the enemy to either trigger or listen in on your broadcasts.
(And the more widely you share IFF codes with allies, the more chances enemy spies have, etc.)
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It's difficult for me to believe that three F-15s were shot down by friendly fire in two days.
It's much, much easier for me to believe that the American - and world's - military-industrial apparatus will say and do whatever it takes to keep the headlines from reading "$100,000,000 F-15 Strike Eagle Brought Down By $5,000 Drones."
@mhoye I can absolutely believe it, especially when you have kegsbreath on TV saying shit like "no more stupid rules of engagement".
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It's difficult for me to believe that three F-15s were shot down by friendly fire in two days.
It's much, much easier for me to believe that the American - and world's - military-industrial apparatus will say and do whatever it takes to keep the headlines from reading "$100,000,000 F-15 Strike Eagle Brought Down By $5,000 Drones."
@mhoye
Honestly, it could go either way with meI served in the US Navy—on aircraft carriers—from 1984-2005
Every one of the six carrier deployments I participated in saw us lose at least one aircraft to accident or maintenance issue
During that same time period, I recall several incidents that never made it into the news, such as the practice bomb that was dropped onto one of the smaller ships and nearly killed two people, and the time when the pilots got lost on their way to the practice range and bombed a historic ghost town
Then there the whole invasion of Iraq where the US attacked it's own ground troops because they didn't realize that the tanks were making better time than anticipated (and said tanks didn't carry IFF)
Sure, it's possible that they are spinning a loss to unpiloted aircraft, but just as likely that they shot themselves, because that shit happens all the time, but does not get reported
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