With all the tiktok drama I have been telling people Mastodon is still here and kicking!!
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Curating content is real work. Tiktok didn't talk about it a lot but they put a great deal of effort into making the first experience users had with the app fun.
Showing them things they'd never seen before that were funny, or exciting ... using the spy data to tailor it to the particular user. Using the way the user scrolled to improve that experience.
I felt very self-conscious when trying tiktok for a bit a while back. Just because I watched some middle aged British weirdo filming police officers and asserting his right to do so, I got more and people filming police officers content. Not the content I was really wanting to look for. Maybe I am too old, but for me the decide what I want to see by who I follow model works so much better.
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@futurebird @bovaz @aurochs You eventually have to decide if it's a conversation or entertainment.
(You're presenting as so completely on Team Entertainment that it's not clear you're aware Team Conversation is an option.)
Much of the design and much of the "not welcoming" is because Team Conversation's objectives generally include "this is not entertainment"; that is, it's a social interaction rather than a performance.
"Social media", commercially, exists to confuse that distinction.
@graydon @futurebird @bovaz @aurochs
Fedi isn't all that good at conversations either. Since it's arranged by posts rather than threads, it's a firehose of out-of-context comments. I miss stuff I want to see because it gets drowned in the noise or comes in at 2AM. -
@Bumblefish @futurebird @Phosphenes @bovaz @aurochs Yes and no, I spent many of my early days online in a fan community for the Animal Crossing videogame saga made by people 10-15 years older than me at time (even because a 12 years old is very unlikely to have the skills and the money to rent and host stuff on a server).
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With all the tiktok drama I have been telling people Mastodon is still here and kicking!! I love this app and I really think the decentralized model is the best for social media.
Still, people don’t want to join! What do you think Mastodon’s biggest barriers are to courting new users? What could be done to improve the product and grow the user base in a positive way?
@taylorlorenz please stop telling people about Mastodon. They might actually listen one day and all come here and ruin it for us hahaha
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What if we had a kind of mini-app where users could create their own algorithms and then share combine and trade them?
I might design a mix of hashtags, users, and hand picked posts and call it "Ant News" someone else might pick a group of users and hash tags and create "Italian Football Bloopers"
Then we could share and rate these feeds and new users could just click on the popular ones?
@futurebird @aurochs But how it is easier to pick from all these user-created feeds than it is to pick between all the actual user-feeds?
You still got a big directory you're asking people to look through rather than spoon-feeding them by having a robot spy on them and deciding what kinds of things they might like.
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@futurebird@sauropods.win @Phosphenes@mastodon.social @aurochs@todon.eu Honestly, I love the "no ads" thing, but not everyone I know agrees. Sure, they complain about ads, but it's mostly where they interrupt what they are doing. Often, they don't mind, or even enjoy, well done ads that fit with the flow of what they are doing.
The ad industry thought that making people numb by forcing more ads at us from everywhere all the time was the solution, but in truth well made well placed ads turn out to be seamless, and people don't mind them.@bovaz @futurebird @Phosphenes @aurochs I work for a magazine publisher and I agree. I’ve seen really bad print ads but they don’t prevent you from reading the stories.
Exception: perfume sampler ads. The person who invented them should be in jail.
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@graydon @futurebird @bovaz @aurochs
Fedi isn't all that good at conversations either. Since it's arranged by posts rather than threads, it's a firehose of out-of-context comments. I miss stuff I want to see because it gets drowned in the noise or comes in at 2AM.@trachelipus It could certainly be better if the formal design process didn't keep trying to say "both" when both is not a real option and shifted the design to "supports conversation".
(Note that emojis, tiktok, and probably things I don't know about work by supporting socially encrypted conversation that relies on knowledge of visual media that allow conversation without using your words. "Cannot be comprehended by olds" is important to the kids.)
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I think that the http://dropout.tv fandom would be a great one to try what the forkiverse did but don't know who to suggest it to.
@gbargoud Their contact form focuses more on troubleshooting, but there is an email on https://www.dropout.tv/about.
Might be worth a shot?
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@gbargoud Their contact form focuses more on troubleshooting, but there is an email on https://www.dropout.tv/about.
Might be worth a shot?
I did, it went to Vimeo support but they might forward it on
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@bovaz @aurochs @futurebird @Phosphenes "Often, they don't mind, or even enjoy, well done ads that fit with the flow of what they are doing."
LMAO no. Lies folks dependent on advertising tell themselves. Sigh.
@bovaz @aurochs @futurebird @Phosphenes Moreover, "ads that fit with the flow" do much greater harm.
When an annoying ad interrupts what you're doing, it makes you angry at whoever placed it, not favorable towards what they want you to desire or think.
When an ad is slipped in between Facebook posts disguised as something a friend shared, it's more likely to manipulate you.
That's a big part of why we have such a nazi problem.
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I did, it went to Vimeo support but they might forward it on
@gbargoud Nice! Fingers crossed!
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@bovaz @aurochs @futurebird @Phosphenes "Often, they don't mind, or even enjoy, well done ads that fit with the flow of what they are doing."
LMAO no. Lies folks dependent on advertising tell themselves. Sigh.
@dalias@hachyderm.io @aurochs@todon.eu @futurebird@sauropods.win @Phosphenes@mastodon.social I was just saying what I'm seeing anecdotally from the people around me who I see using IG and tiktok. -
@taylorlorenz I think one of the best ways is to recommend specific instances to people, that helps with being overwhelmed with options, etc. I've recommended this one I'm on (c.im) to several people and have had a couple join up that way.
@jake4480 @taylorlorenz Good point. I think people stumble right at the start because they overthink instances.
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The fedi is slowly becoming a NORC (naturally occurring retirement community)
Only facebook has an older userbase.
And being more old than young that isn't a personal problem. But I wish there was more interest in making it a place younger people would care about. And that would mean listening to them.
@futurebird @Phosphenes @bovaz @aurochs I settled here after losing several commercially run on-line communities.
Being able to lose a server but keep your community is a feature that people who *haven't* gone through that wouldn't appreciate quite as much
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@bovaz @aurochs @futurebird @Phosphenes Moreover, "ads that fit with the flow" do much greater harm.
When an annoying ad interrupts what you're doing, it makes you angry at whoever placed it, not favorable towards what they want you to desire or think.
When an ad is slipped in between Facebook posts disguised as something a friend shared, it's more likely to manipulate you.
That's a big part of why we have such a nazi problem.
@dalias@hachyderm.io @aurochs@todon.eu @futurebird@sauropods.win @Phosphenes@mastodon.social "ads that fit with the flow" CAN do much greater harm, in my opinion, depending on the ad, but I admit I'm not the greatest expert on the topic, so I may be wrong. -
@futurebird@sauropods.win @Phosphenes@mastodon.social @aurochs@todon.eu Honestly, I love the "no ads" thing, but not everyone I know agrees. Sure, they complain about ads, but it's mostly where they interrupt what they are doing. Often, they don't mind, or even enjoy, well done ads that fit with the flow of what they are doing.
The ad industry thought that making people numb by forcing more ads at us from everywhere all the time was the solution, but in truth well made well placed ads turn out to be seamless, and people don't mind them.@bovaz For the record, I mind ads existing at all, anywhere, ever.
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@futurebird Have you seen https://fedidevs.com/s/NjQ5/ by any chance? Seems like a pretty solid list!
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@taylorlorenz @aurochs At BMorePunk we have an account set up named @bootstraps.
Every user who signs up follows them by default. The account just me boosting things so new people don't have an empty timeline.
It's not perfect. It is a lot of work. But it at least let's new people skip the empty/uninteresting timeline. It bootstraps new people into the network.
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@jbd @hfinyow @taylorlorenz apart from that bloated elephant in the room called mastodon.social
@erikcats @jbd @hfinyow @taylorlorenz
Mastodon.social is the reason I ended up joining mastodon. I had been from reddit to Lemmy which were both ruled by this huge array of little tyrant mods. mastodon.social being too large to bully and largely hands off moderation except for the egregious stuff (racism etc.) was ideal.
I'm sure there are reasonably run smaller instances out there, but going on recommendations isn't enough, people are biased for their instance. Social allows for acclimation.
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The fedi is slowly becoming a NORC (naturally occurring retirement community)
Only facebook has an older userbase.
And being more old than young that isn't a personal problem. But I wish there was more interest in making it a place younger people would care about. And that would mean listening to them.
@futurebird @Phosphenes @bovaz @aurochs I think this would require actual innovation to make new forms of social media that kids would enjoy instead of just rehashing older social media platforms.
