UK PEOPLE: this is REALLY IMPORTANT.
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@cstross @david_chisnall The likelihood of the police taking my computer for forensic examination is zero.
I have plenty of things that I must keep private. So does everyone.
@Fonant @cstross @david_chisnall actually it's one unfortunate incident or altercation in the street or false report or log interpretation error or mistaken identity or... or... or... etc away.
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RE: https://social.vivaldi.net/@LonM/115966748145817371
UK PEOPLE: this is REALLY IMPORTANT. If the government bans under-16s from using VPNs, then logically they must intend to REQUIRE AGE VERIFICATION FOR ALL VPN USE. Which will affect adults too!
*Your* privacy and right to anonymous web browsing is at risk!
@cstross I have a fleet of devices in the field that communicate back to my infrastructure over VPN links. Do those devices now have to prove they're over 16? Do both ends? Does anybody in charge have any fucking idea what they're doing?
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Well the "home lan" is effectively the "corporate use case" I described, just for advanced IT folk.. (I used to do the same).
The geoblocking use case is "fair" in the sense that it "just works", but almost certainly contravenes the streaming service providers T&Cs. It does nothing for privacy, since you clearly log into these services.
(Psst: I also use TOR to get around geoblocking.. not quite as convenient, but free)
@oschonrock @PeterSommerlad @cstross This gets at a particularly dumb part of “banning VPNs”: the VPN is just the transport mechanism the proxy service uses.
No, we’re not a VPN, we’re a SOCKS proxy.
No, SOCKS is banned now, so we shut that down. We do offer a QUIC proxy, though.
And so on.
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@oschonrock @Fonant @PeterSommerlad Labour has a nasty paternalist/nanny state tradition going back over a century. It's baked in at this point: Labour knows what's best for you, peasant. (So do the Tories, but they approach it differently.)
@cstross @oschonrock @Fonant @PeterSommerlad Perhaps try putting a labour MP in charge of the labour party instead of a fucking tory.... It failed with Blair and it is failing with Starmer.
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@cstross @oschonrock @Fonant @PeterSommerlad Perhaps try putting a labour MP in charge of the labour party instead of a fucking tory.... It failed with Blair and it is failing with Starmer.
@Ulrich_the_elder @cstross @Fonant @PeterSommerlad TBF... Blair was better..
He communicated better. So he managed to achieve more things that a labour govt should..
Notably in education for him..
But yeah he fucked it up by being a religious nutcase going on crusades in the middle east...(Very Tory) Among other things
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RE: https://social.vivaldi.net/@LonM/115966748145817371
UK PEOPLE: this is REALLY IMPORTANT. If the government bans under-16s from using VPNs, then logically they must intend to REQUIRE AGE VERIFICATION FOR ALL VPN USE. Which will affect adults too!
*Your* privacy and right to anonymous web browsing is at risk!
@cstross it also means banning anyone under age from owning/renting a server in a different country, with very much the same implications for people over the age limit, since setting up a VPN endpoint is reasonably easy enough for your average technically inclined 16 year old. Oh and also, it outlaws TOR, if taken to its logical conclusion.
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RE: https://social.vivaldi.net/@LonM/115966748145817371
UK PEOPLE: this is REALLY IMPORTANT. If the government bans under-16s from using VPNs, then logically they must intend to REQUIRE AGE VERIFICATION FOR ALL VPN USE. Which will affect adults too!
*Your* privacy and right to anonymous web browsing is at risk!
@cstross Haven't adults clued into the fact that trying to force kids into boxes never works out? On top of the privacy issues.
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RE: https://social.vivaldi.net/@LonM/115966748145817371
UK PEOPLE: this is REALLY IMPORTANT. If the government bans under-16s from using VPNs, then logically they must intend to REQUIRE AGE VERIFICATION FOR ALL VPN USE. Which will affect adults too!
*Your* privacy and right to anonymous web browsing is at risk!
@cstross as a kid growing up in europe and taught again and again about the resistance, I'd always thought that my lack of physical prowess would mean I'd be mostly useless if it ever happened again. But now that it's rearing it's head all I can hear is my mother saying "you'll never amount to anything spending all your days on that computer". Look at me now mom, my knowledge may just save the free world.
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@cstross it also means banning anyone under age from owning/renting a server in a different country, with very much the same implications for people over the age limit, since setting up a VPN endpoint is reasonably easy enough for your average technically inclined 16 year old. Oh and also, it outlaws TOR, if taken to its logical conclusion.
@sophieschmieg @cstross When I was a kid and somebody would ask my parents if I was old enough for a given book, they would say: "If he is innocent, he won't understand and it won't hurt him. If he isn't, and understands it, it won't hurt him."
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RE: https://social.vivaldi.net/@LonM/115966748145817371
UK PEOPLE: this is REALLY IMPORTANT. If the government bans under-16s from using VPNs, then logically they must intend to REQUIRE AGE VERIFICATION FOR ALL VPN USE. Which will affect adults too!
*Your* privacy and right to anonymous web browsing is at risk!
@cstross Soon you'll need to get your age verified before you can use an age-verification service.
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RE: https://social.vivaldi.net/@LonM/115966748145817371
UK PEOPLE: this is REALLY IMPORTANT. If the government bans under-16s from using VPNs, then logically they must intend to REQUIRE AGE VERIFICATION FOR ALL VPN USE. Which will affect adults too!
*Your* privacy and right to anonymous web browsing is at risk!
@cstross I've written to my MP about this already, so an easy decision to add my signature to the petition.
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RE: https://social.vivaldi.net/@LonM/115966748145817371
UK PEOPLE: this is REALLY IMPORTANT. If the government bans under-16s from using VPNs, then logically they must intend to REQUIRE AGE VERIFICATION FOR ALL VPN USE. Which will affect adults too!
*Your* privacy and right to anonymous web browsing is at risk!
@cstross Wait... presumably age verification shouldn't be required if payment method = credit card, right?
Only over 18's can obtain a credit card.
Anyone age 16-18 is in a pickle though.
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@oschonrock @cstross @Fonant @PeterSommerlad One reason for a Twitter ban is that it would then be much more difficult for people to excuse their presence there. And for people not wanting to be there but feel pressured to, to get an excuse to leave.
@ahltorp @cstross @Fonant @PeterSommerlad
indeed.. that, plus the inconvenience of having to use VPNs etc would pretty much kill it dead within a couple of months IMO.
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@cstross Soon you'll need to get your age verified before you can use an age-verification service.
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@dan @only_ohm @cstross @Nicovel0 the language is inexact so they can make it mean what they think it should, yeah. or more accurate they hope they'll figure it out later when stuff comes up. Like "provided to a significant number of persons" could mean literally anything, even if we could theorycraft what it probably means
As for TOR, well, my guess is it qualifies but enforcing it is another question. Possible, but seems like it'd just be wack-a-mole
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@Fonant @david_chisnall @cstross
"We don't need to worry, because the govt will not be able to enforce it" is the counterpart to legislators who say "we don't need to put in detailed definitions & restrictions, because we trust police & prosecutors to use the powers responsibly".
History has proven both are always true until they aren't.@HighlandLawyer im not sure there is any other way, you always have to trust people to use their best judgement, and use systems of accountability to bring people into alignment with standards, _after_ the fact. I think thats true at several scales
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@cstross vpns have their place in corporate networks.
There they provide secure access to internal resources for remote workers.
They are all but useless for personal privacy / anonymity.
So while I agree with the principle of your objection to govts gating services - it is actually a faux battle based on misinformation by the VPN industry.
@oschonrock @cstross Curious that the government would bother banning them, then.
